A look at herds / living post disaster (What are your thoughts?)

elevan

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Someone started this over on BYC...it's been and interesting read but most of the posters are only familiar with chickens and the picks for other animals seem a little "out there" at times.

So I thought that this forum here at BYH would be able to provide an educational look at what animals and items you would want to have if the world as we know it suddenly changed and we had to fend for ourselves without outside support.

This is purely hypothetical (I don't believe the world is ending tomorrow or anything)...just looking for some different views of life in an off the grid situation.

1. What animals would you choose? Be breed specific and why?
2. What veggies / fruits / herbs would you grow?
3. What supplies would you feel you couldn't live without?


Feel free to give different scenarios based on the type of disaster that you think we might face...(the reason we go off grid)...
 

elevan

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My thoughts...

Chickens - a good dual purpose breed like buckeyes...which are also very good foragers...providing eggs, meat and feathers.
Yak - able to ride, plow, pull, eat and use fiber...very good at utilizing a larger variety of plants for food.
Pygmy or Nigerian Dwarf goats - milk, meat and hide...a small footprint and able to utilize a smaller area of land at a time
Pot Belly pig - they are small, require less food and can be stored on the hoof...a smaller amount of meat means less chance of rot...since we wouldn't have refrigeration...
Rabbits - meat and hide / fur...they could be fed grass...

I also have a pond...so stocked with fish...it also provides good food source and lots of frogs there too...

Veggies for me would be corn, zucchini, tomatoes, acorn squash...as they all grow easily with out disease or pest problems for me already.

Fruit...I have apple, peach, cherry and plum trees already.

I also have a honey locust tree which has edible pods and seeds...it's thorns can be used to make blow darts and nails.

We have black walnut trees and hickory nut trees too.

I have a small pond that is loaded with cattails...good for eating too...different parts for different times of year.

I think a greenhouse would be important for growing in the winter months here.

A gun of course for protection and hunting...but perhaps a bow would be better because arrows would be easier to reuse and bullets may become difficult to find.

Tools...hammer, hand saw, shovel, hoe, scythe

Canning jars and lids.

9-volt batteries and steel wool (easy firestarter)

A hand pump for the well...

A good book on medicinal plants as well as an edible plant field guide would be important.
 

Livinwright Farm

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elevan said:
Someone started this over on BYC...it's been and interesting read but most of the posters are only familiar with chickens and the picks for other animals seem a little "out there" at times.

So I thought that this forum here at BYH would be able to provide an educational look at what animals and items you would want to have if the world as we know it suddenly changed and we had to fend for ourselves without outside support.

This is purely hypothetical (I don't believe the world is ending tomorrow or anything)...just looking for some different views of life in an off the grid situation.

1. What animals would you choose? Be breed specific and why?
2. What veggies / fruits would you grow?
3. What supplies would you feel you couldn't live without?


Feel free to give different scenarios based on the type of disaster that you think we might face...(the reason we go off grid)...
Good thread Emily!

Okay:
1)
Chickens:
Wyandottes- decent producers of eggs and the males(like my Sour) bulk up on air.
Black Giants- dual purpose birds.
Black Australorps- heavy producers of large eggs(holds the record for # of eggs/yr)

Goats:
Mixed breeds- Nigerian, Boer or Kiko, Lamancha or Alpine, and Pygmy:
I want smaller sized goats that are multi purposed for dairy, land clearing, and meat.

I live near rivers, lakes, and close enough to the ocean for fishing access/availability.

Rabbits- Any bulky breed. Why? Two words: Complete Protein.

Deer- venison & skin is a MUST have! I can either raise them or hunt them and their cousins(Moose) without leaving my property.

Turkey- easily hunted on my own property.

Horse/horses- for riding, labor, and if it came down to it(last resort), food.

Alpaca and/or Angora goats- for their fiber to spin.

Black Bear- hunting, not owning... obviously. For skin & meat. (bear sausage is REALLY good!!)

2)
Cherry, peach, nectarine, pear, apricot, and apple trees for canning, freezing over winter, candying, and dehydrating.

Strawberries, blackberries, raspberries, watermelon, cantaloupe, blueberries, and grapes.

Shagbark Hickory(Maple Nut) trees all around our property in southern NH.

Carrots, butternut squash, zucchini, summer squash, cabbage, bell peppers, tomatoes, potatoes, garlic, onions, beans, peas, eggplant, radish, turnip, brussels sprouts, lettuce, spinach, cucumbers, pumpkin, acorn squash, peanuts, and sunflowers.

you didn't mention herbs, but I have to say that mullein is/would be a MUST have/grow medicinal.

3)
Shotgun/rifle, appropriate ammo, bb gun, necessary animal processing items, canning supplies, batteries(like yacht & larger), woodstove, ax, fishing supplies, a still(for medicinal tinctures), sewing/knitting/crocheting supplies, and (like you mentioned) a greenhouse/hot house for growing overwinter.

Thankfully, we live on a property that has an old springhouse foundation(needs some repair to the east wall), so we would never be without refrigeration, and winters are cold enough that food would stay frozen packed into snow banks.

Did you ever watch Jericho on CBS? I'm gonna go with something along those lines as far as the reason why were go off the grid.
 

elevan

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I was beginning to wonder if maybe this thread was gonna be a dud...thanks for responding Livinwright!

Question for you:
Livinwright Farm said:
you didn't mention herbs, but I have to say that mullein is/would be a MUST have/grow medicinal.
What is Mullein?


eta: I edited original post to add herbs ;)
 

Livinwright Farm

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elevan said:
I was beginning to wonder if maybe this thread was gonna be a dud...thanks for responding Livinwright!

Question for you:
Livinwright Farm said:
you didn't mention herbs, but I have to say that mullein is/would be a MUST have/grow medicinal.
What is Mullein?


eta: I edited original post to add herbs ;)
Any time Emily! :thumbsup

Here is an image of it.
http://www.davidphotoart.org/images/recent/mullein.jpg

And a link for one page(if you google it, you will find pages and pages about it): http://www.herbs2000.com/herbs/herbs_mullein.htm :)
 

elevan

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Livinwright Farm said:
elevan said:
I was beginning to wonder if maybe this thread was gonna be a dud...thanks for responding Livinwright!

Question for you:
Livinwright Farm said:
you didn't mention herbs, but I have to say that mullein is/would be a MUST have/grow medicinal.
What is Mullein?


eta: I edited original post to add herbs ;)
Any time Emily! :thumbsup

Here is an image of it.
http://www.davidphotoart.org/images/recent/mullein.jpg

And a link for one page(if you google it, you will find pages and pages about it): http://www.herbs2000.com/herbs/herbs_mullein.htm :)
Interesting stuff. Thanks for the info.
 

patandchickens

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Poultry:

Any reasonably-meaty-dual-purpose chicken breed (certain lines of rocks or wyandottes, or chanteclers, or even my sussexes are generally decent in that regard -- NOT jersey giants however which require WAY WAY too much feed to reach their size)

If the above breed does not tend reasonably strongly towards broodiness in your particular line, also keep a small flock of something very broody (silkies or any of a number of other options), preferably small-bodied.

Arguably also something small-bodied that lays well (leghorns, etc) -- I do not know as everyone would want to be maintaining full-sized breeding flocks of all three of these chicken types, but you'd want them to be around and available to you.

Also arguably a good meat-type turkey, Beltsville Small Whites would be my suggestion of the ones I've grown myself.

Of the above list, I would probably stick with my sussexes plus something small-foragey-and-high-laying; adding turkeys in the fullness of time if it seemed feasible. (I have them now, but they do eat a lot over winter...)

Hoofstock:

Cattle. Absolutely without question can't do without (unless you are on VERY thin-grazing land in which case might have to punt to goats or sheep, but they have many disadvantages) because not only do they provide meat and milk and good hide, they provide LABOR in the form of training oxen.

If you think you can protect them from predators, I'd say also sheep (for the wool as much as for the meat) if you have grassy or weedy circumstances, or goats if it is more forested/brushy -- but lacking modern conveniences of heavy wire fencing, electric fencing, and unlimited ammunition, in a lot of areas I think you could easily lose most or all of your sheep/goats in the first few years. Even *with* a LGD, if you don't also have the ability to keep your fencing in reasonable repair.

Hogs, not necessarily for everybody but you'd want them available to them as can keep them fed. Smaller breeds, possibly *fattier* breeds as you might be really WANTING that oil not just for cooking but for other purposes as well.

Horses would be nice but IMO optional as long as you have oxen.

Of the above options, personally on this property I'd want a couple cattle (including a milk cow but NOT including a bull, that is what neighbors are for LOL) and would keep the sheep at least until I ran out of them due to coyotes. Too wet for hogs, and the horses would be nonuseful here and have to go, alas.

Veggies and fruits thing is too big a ball o' wax to go into in this post, save to observe that the most productive store-a-long-time things I could grow around here are tomatoes, potatoes, greenbeans, and winter squash; also apples but those would have to mainly come from neighbors as we only have 3 trees and they are still pretty young/small. Obviuosly this is not ALL one would grow, but I think it would be the backbone of our diet during the non growing season, plant-food-wise.

JMHO,

Pat
 

Melissa'sDreamFarm

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This is the reason I got animals. Not that I think that the world's going to end, but what if there were interruption in government? Hostile take overs, electricity shortages, gas shortages and such? As a mom, it is my responsibility to provide for my family.

1. Nigerian Dwarf or mini-mixed goats. Smaller sized so no need to refrigerate the meat. Cycle all year, so I could breed to eat and milk.

2. Plymouth Rock Chickens. Right now I have barred and blue rocks. They are a good dual purpose bird. I think Wyanedottes are more "useful", but I have not found the ones I would want to breed temperament wise yet. I'm still looking.

3. Raised beds. My tiller will eventually run out of gas and I want to save the gas for the chainsaw. The longer I can put off chopping trees by hand the better. I can amend soil in the beds and plant my heirloom veggies. I have the knowledge to save seeds, this is important. Even if you don't want to bother with saving the seeds, at least have the knowledge.

4. Books, how to books, planting guides, animal husbandry books, medical emergency books, herbal cures, how to recognize herbs kind of book. I have a few already and am always looking at the used book store for more.

5. Seeds, squash of any kind grows well here, tomatoes, peppers, cilantro, garlic, onions, basil, dill. These are the things I remember right now. I know I have more, but these things mentioned I can save the seed to replant.

6. Ammo. This is a sore spot with me. I do not have a gun in the house out of fear that my son who is 8 will try to play with it. I do own a gun, it's just not here. I also have a supply of ammo for my gun. I need to consider a bow and arrow, or at least a book on how to make one.

7. Utensils. I have a collection of knives for processing meat. I have a nice collection of cast iron pots and pans. I also have a hand made fire pit. It's a luxury now, but can be utilized to cook on. I also have several trees cut and curing out. I have a nice collection of salt, pepper, and baking soda. It does not go bad, so I add to my collection all the time. Rope, rope, and more rope.

8. Soap, I know I could make my own (I have a book for it, lol) but I can use my soap for as long as it lasts. It doesn't go bad. I have a stock pile.

9. Access to water. I have 4 wells on my property. One is an old "open" well. We also have 6 ponds around my house and a small stream only 1/4 mile from my house.

I do have two horses for transportation and plowing. They are both geldings and I don't know if I could overwinter them safely. If it does get bad. It's not what you have, but how are you going to keep it (protect) and you or your family still be alive. If you have something, eventually someone will find you and want to take it from you. At this point in my life, I don't think I could kill someone. But faced with a life or death situation, I don't know what I'm capable of. Unfortunately, they don't make a book for that. It's nice to plan I have, but I just don't know how long I can hold onto it.

ETA:
10. I have 3 pear trees, 2 plum, and 2 apple. I know how to dry apple and will be experimenting with plum this year.

Need a resource on canning/preserving the "old fashioned" way. I can pickle, but how is vinegar made? I guess I would need grapes.
 

freemotion

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Skills are the most important thing to have. Theoretical knowledge is better than nothing....but not by much! A lot is left out of books and articles.

Focus on any food source that reproduces....chickens that go broody (forget what the catalogs say, many modern breeds just won't go broody), and as was said, heirloom veggies that seeds can be saved from.

Know what you can forage in your area and how to prepare it.

Know what your property can grow and how to store it. Do so now, even on a small scale. Growing food is a learned skill and I sure was surprised a few years ago when I started that it is not as simple as sticking seeds in the ground and watering and weeding. You need to know a lot of details....spacing, timing, planting depth, etc, for each type of plant.

Practice storage and preservation methods that do not need electricity.

If you expect to keep grains in your diet, know how to grow them, store them, and prepare them. Know proper preparation methods to avoid deficiencies that come from a high-grain diet when the grains are not properly prepared.

Know how to kill, clean, and preserve your choice of meat animals.

Know a LOT about nutrition so you can stay healthy without medical care. A fully self-sufficient life can be very, very healthy nutritionally. Get a copy of Nourishing Traditions if you don't already have one.
 

Livinwright Farm

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elevan said:
Livinwright Farm said:
elevan said:
I was beginning to wonder if maybe this thread was gonna be a dud...thanks for responding Livinwright!

Question for you:

What is Mullein?


eta: I edited original post to add herbs ;)
Any time Emily! :thumbsup

Here is an image of it.
http://www.davidphotoart.org/images/recent/mullein.jpg

And a link for one page(if you google it, you will find pages and pages about it): http://www.herbs2000.com/herbs/herbs_mullein.htm :)
Interesting stuff. Thanks for the info.
You're welcome! ;)
Oh, and I forgot to add harvesting cat tails for grinding their dried roots into flour. & Juniper berries as a coffee substitute.
 

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