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Goat: SNAKEBITE (Copperhead~updated) (It's Socrates)

Discussion in 'Emergencies, Injuries, Diseases, and Cures' started by redtailgal, May 21, 2012.

  1. May 21, 2012
    redtailgal

    redtailgal New Member

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    *****If you have this emergency right now please do the following immediately, then return to read the rest****

    You may or may not see the actual bite, they will swell shut quickly, often no blood will be seen.

    You will notice extreme pain in the general area and swelling......you can WATCH it swell.

    IMMEDIATELY ice the area (I used a bag of frozen green peas). 10 minutes on/ 10 minutes off. Use a water hose if you have to, but cool the area down. They may scream, you may cry. Do it anyway. You'll need to do this for several hours, be ready for the long haul.

    Medicate: Banamine at 1 cc per 100 pounds. if you dont have Banamine, you can use Children's Benedryl as the dosage (by weight not age) on the package.

    Your goat (or any critter with snakebite) will need CLEAN water at all times, and COLD water would be wonderful. Change it alot, clean buckets add ice......CLEAN COLD WATER. helps with the swelling.

    In between ice sessions, call your vet for recommendations. If you live in an area where anti-venom is available, be prepared its VERY costly.

    Most animals will survive with only the treatments above, many will survive with no treatment. Socrates had a secondary reaction which complicated things.

    Do the above things and read the rest later.





    4.00 pm (original post)

    About an hour ago, Socrates came running to the barn shaking his head violently and foaming at the mouth. Then he started swelling. You could WATCH him swell.

    Both sides of the jaw, and about halfway down the neck. The bite wound itself is swollen shut, so I can't clean it. He is able to eat and drink. The swelling has stopped, and went down a little with cold compression.

    I am treating with Banamine for pain and swelling. Plenty of COLD COLD water, and plan to ice the site hourly. I will also be monitoring for a fever as hour.

    I'll be picking up some hay stretcher and/or alfalfa pellets as its pretty hard for him to eat hay (it hurts).

    I have pen-g here, and will give it if I see signs of an infection starting.

    Any other suggestions?

    *I will not do a preemptive strike with antibiotics......I dont give them as prevention.

    10.15 pm (update)

    I gave bendryl and called Doc. He was on his way to look at this mare anyway, so he kicked it up a notch and risked a speeding ticket. GOOD THING HE DID.

    After icing him down, it looked like the swelling was going down, but after doc got here Socrates had a secondary reaction with added swelling. His eye were swollen shut, and his mouth swollen open. The tips of his ears looked like they would explode.

    We found a bite in between the jaw bones, under the chin, and a second one on his tongue. Yes, his freaking TONGUE. We think the snake struck again when he screamed from the first bite.

    He went into agonal breathing, was using accesory muscles, the whole works. We turned the water hose on him, dosed him hard with fast acting steroids and antihistamines, and put in a port to give solid access in case his heart stopped, so we could give epi.

    I also had Doc draw up the Euthanol, just in case.

    Took him a while of good HARD work to get a breath in, but the swelling went down and he started screaming again, only this time it was because he was ANGRY, lol. He was REALLY ticked at us, but too weak to do much about it.

    Once We felt he was stable, I saddlebagged him some fluids. I chose to saddlebag so that he would have a slow release of electrolytes for several hours, rather than getting them all at once in an IV and pee them right back out.

    Then I had to run an errand, and left him in the care of my hubby.

    I just returned to find a very angry goat, who would have NOTHING to do with me, but was CHEWING his cud!

    Long term treatment:

    Continued ice therapy until the swelling is gone.

    Final dose of Banamine tomorrow evening.

    Supplement with grain.........its very hard for him to eat hay right now, so I"ll get some hay stretcher pellets for him.

    Doc wants him monitored closely for a worm bloom. This happens alot with cattle, snake bite puts such a stress on the body, there is often a worm bloom afterwards.

    NO antibiotics right now. We will wait to see signs of infection. I dont do preventative antibiotics. He will be closely monitored for fever and started on Pen-G at the first sign of infection.

    Daily probios for awhile. Snakebite really works a number on the digestive tract, not to mention the stress and genuine TERROR that he felt from the way we had to handle him. He is high risk for bloat, worms, etc right now (another reason to hold off on the antibiotics)

    Plenty of rest, and quiet.

    What happened was a secondary reaction. Venom is venomous because people are allergic to it.......the reaction is basically an allergic reaction. Socrates has a HIGH sensitivity to it, so we will be keeping Epi in the barn at all times. It MAY help the next time or it may not.

    So, right now, things are ok. I am worried about infection and an abcess forming. I'll treat that when it happens, gotta get him thru this first. With the reaction that he had, the main concern is that his gut doesnt shut down. The fact that he was chewing cud was a very very good sign.



    2.14 am

    went out for a recheck. he is trying to swell up a little more, so I ice him up again. (He really is starting to hate the site of frozen peas). seems well enough, is chewing cud. I'm going to bed.
     
  2. May 21, 2012
    SmallFarmGirl

    SmallFarmGirl Smiley Crazy

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    :hugs I have no idea how to help you, but I hope someone else can! HOW terrible!
     
  3. May 21, 2012
    Roll farms

    Roll farms Spot Master

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    Sorry, kiddo, snakebite is one thing I've got no experience treating.....

    Would benadryl help at all?
     
  4. May 21, 2012
    redtailgal

    redtailgal New Member

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    Just gave benedryl, lol.

    Its so strange, it LOOKS just like bottlejaw, but it hurts him to have it touched and the swelling was so terribly quick. I WATCHED him swell.

    Doc is on his way. I'll have pics of his jaws later.

    gotta go ice the goat
     
  5. May 21, 2012
    daisychick

    daisychick Overrun with beasties

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    Any way it is a poisonous snake (not sure what kind you have there) ??? My dog got bit by a rattler and her face swelled up right before my eyes. Anti-venom cured it really fast. If it's not a poisonous bite then I would say what you are doing is good. Benadryl might be a good idea.
     
  6. May 21, 2012
    BarredRockMomma

    BarredRockMomma Loving the herd life

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    :hugs and praying for my favorite silly goat :hugs

    I only know how to treat them in people sorry. :(
     
  7. May 21, 2012
    terrilhb

    terrilhb True BYH Addict

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    I have just been reading a book call Natural Goat Care by Pat Coleby. In it she says to give 15 cc's of Vitamin C intramuscularly in the side of the neck and repeat in 2 hours if necessary. I recieved this bbok from the woman I bought my does from. I hope Socrates gets better really quick. I am sorry this happened. I do not know if this works. She says it does. Also she says if you locate the bite to rub some sodium ascorbate powder well into the bite as this effectively stops the pain which can be considerable. And to keep the goat quiet and and it's feet eating well. I hope this helps some.
     
  8. May 21, 2012
    redtailgal

    redtailgal New Member

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    It was a copperhead. Venom, yes. Usually not fatal, but very very painful.

    The anti-venom is not available to livestock here. (we have ALOT of copperheads, and not much anti-venom, so it's reserved for people).

    He is resting. Poor guy........if his ears tough the side of his face it hurts. The pain should subside by tomorrow, but we have to manage the swelling so that it wont cut off his airway. Icing it down seems to be helping alot with the swelling.

    Doc is with him now, but he told me to leave. Socrates want ME not doc, lol.

    NEVER a dull moment.

    What is the vit c supposed to do? Any other tips to help with swelling?
     
  9. May 21, 2012
    WhiteMountainsRanch

    WhiteMountainsRanch Loving the herd life

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    I don't know if this applies to goats but I know vitamin K shots help because snake venom makes the blood thinner and not clot.
     
  10. May 21, 2012
    redtailgal

    redtailgal New Member

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    He is having a secondary release and reaction.

    His eyes are swollen shut, as is his nose. On his side and mouth breathing.

    I wont be on for awhile. I've got to hold him up, and apply ice, while doc runs some fast acting steroids and makes a port for epi.

    Please pray