Goats in the attic?

[JoyfulGoats]

I'm glad you mentioned 2 doors and the solid section. I can just imagine trying to swing an 8' wide piece of plywood. Since your reason for "total enclosure" is predator protection, not weather protection I wonder if the upper half of the solid section and the doors could be made with 2x4 wire so there is a lot of light and air. Maybe even everything above shoulder height so they can see out.

That first one must be somewhere it never snows, no way I'd want to shovel everything away down to dirt from the front of it to open the door even a few feet. Unless you are going to raise it off the ground some, I think I'd make it so the bottom of the doors are a foot up, the goats and people can step over.

I don't know goats so someone else can answer whether the goats would like a sleeping platform or not.

I'm not worried about having to shovel snow, because we almost never get more than 3", which melts fairly quickly.

An 8' door would not be great . With the 2 doors, we can choose between only leaving a 2' opening if it's very windy, or 4' if we need to bring something in the shed.

I will think about your wire idea. I know that ventilation is important, but I always feel bad for them if it's windy. I might make one side with a wire window so that they have ventilation but can get out of the wind.

Make sure there is adequate ventilation in whatever you build for them, or they will end up with respiratory issues. What kind of predators are you trying to keep out? I don't lock my goats in at night. They are fairly close to my house though.

I don't know what kind of predators I'm trying to keep out. I've always lived in the city, so here it's just rats (quails) and cats, but the only animals I know for sure live near the land are white-tailed deer, the neighbour's cats and dogs (the dogs are never loose), and a ton of mice. However, there are "sightings" of cougars in the area, which may or may not exist. Apparently they haven't been in the area for like a century, but some scientist still think there are some and people occasionally "see" them. Basically, I'd rather be safe than sorry. Even if there were only cats, I'd prefer to have 4 sides. My animals are my babies. Their sheds will be about 200-300ft from our house.

 

[Bruce]

Coons as well as foxes are a likely threat to your chickens.

If you look up a Wood's style coop you can see how it is possible to have TONS of ventilation and NO drafts. If there are NO openings on the sides, back, roof (not even where they meet), no wind can blow into the structure through the "open" front. Simple back pressure. Your goats can have a half wall in the front and not get wind nor rain nor snow nor dark of, OK they will still get dark of night.

 

[JoyfulGoats]

I did not know that, thanks for the information! So I would need to cap the seams somehow where the sides meet?

I don't know if there are raccoons or foxes, but I'm operating as though they were.

My previous chicken coop had wire doors that were never covered, and my current quail coop has a wire front, but the current shed doesn't. I'm not really sure how I would add ventilation to it. Here is what it looks like (the bow is just to hide my friend's reflection).

I call this shed "the mushroom", because it looks like one with the way to door was placed. I wanted to put it this way, but my grandpa (who helped us build it) insisted for the way it currently is...

Anyways, the window is fixed, so would I have to make a new hole for ventillation? It would not look great. The new shed will have adequate ventilation, but what about this one? If I make a hole on the side, it will be in the wind's direction.

 

[CntryBoy777]

The first one, ya could put some ventilation in the gables. They can be covered with ventilation covers. They are not very expensive and it doesn't take long to install. Also, if the other 3 walls are solid, then a few slits 6"x2' with hardware cloth covering it would increase the flow, too.

 

[Bruce]

You aren't really going to get a lot of airflow just based on hoping the wind blows through some small vents. What you really want is some vents down low and some up high. @CntryBoy777's suggestion of 6" x 2' vents is a good start. The natural convection will pull air in the bottom and send it out the upper vents. Is that coop gabled like the second one or is it a "low in the front, high in the back" flat roof? And where are the roosts? Maybe a couple of more pictures would help.

If it is the second kind and the roosts run near and parallel to the back wall, put high vents on the back wall and low vents on the front wall. You might need some low ones on the side walls as well. The natural convection won't be a powerful wind causing a draft on the birds on the roost.

If it is a gabled roof, you can put a ridge vent in. You'll want to look it up but basically you cut the plywood back a bit on each side of the ridge and fasten the ridge vent down. You can replace the ridge cap that is there now with a ridge vent.

 

[JoyfulGoats]

Sorry, I forgot that we had put vents below the roof. Like in the "overhang" which is technically part of the attic's floor. However, the attic isn't closed. I was thinking of making a door for the animals which would be made of hardware cloth. But I was thinking it over and realized that the reason why we didn't put as much ventilation in this shed was because last year we had lots and the chickens were a bit cold (mostly the silkies). However, the doors are open all year during the day, except maybe 5 days a year, so there is ample ventilation. It is only closed during the night.

 

[Bruce]

The vents under the overhang are soffit vents. Unless there are more vents higher up, they do nothing. Even if there is a vent higher up, there is no air exchange below the soffits. It is unlikely that air that can come in lower down through open doors or windows will create a natural convection out the soffit vents since they aren't high up in the building.

In order of increasing functionality with respect to natural attic ventilation:

1. soffit vents only - worthless because there is nowhere for the air that could come in them to go out
2. gable vent on one end only - worthless for the same reason
3. ridge vent only - no way for air to come in so the hot air in the attic can't go out the vent, think "vacuum"
4. gable vents only - require the wind to blow through from one side to the other but there will be some air exchange when the wind can blow through. The air under the level of the gable vents doesn't get exchanged much
5. soffit and gable vents - hot air can go out the gable vents, replaced with air coming in the soffits which are lower. Not ideal since there isn't any movement in the middle of the space unless the wind is blowing through
6. soffit and ridge vent. Natural convection of the hot air going out the ridge vent pulls air in the soffit vents. Both run the full length of the building.

I think the reason you have gotten by with the coop shut up at night (meaning no ventilation) is due to its size and the small number of chickens within. There is a sufficient volume of air to absorb the ammonia from the chickens pooping and the humidity from their breathing and not cause them a proplem. Since the coop is open during the day, the "stale" are can mix with fresh air.

 

[JoyfulGoats]

Well I think I'll see how it goes. This year the 6 chickens that were previously in 4' wide x 6' long x 4' high will be in a 10' wide x 10' wide x 8' high, with the doors open all day, and if we notice any issues we will add ventilation. Thank you though for the information on the different types of vents. Just wondering, does not having a solid bottom help even if it is "full"? Our shed is almost a foot off the ground, but we will place 1/2" x 1/2" wire cloth on the bottom and fill it up with dirt so that it's no longer floating, but does the fact that there is a direct contact to the ground help? (Just out of curiosity)

Today I was able to find 5' high 2"x4" fence for the price of the 4' fence I had got on sale, so I a, very happy about that.

 

[Bruce]

I'm not sure what the question is. Are you saying that the shed has no floor? Planning to put 1/2" hardware cloth on the ground and up to the sills of the shed? If you fill that with shavings there still won't be any air coming in. If there is any part of the hardware cloth that is not blocked, it would act as a low vent to let air in (which assumes high vents as previously described). Of course chickens scratch all the time so who knows where it would be open and when

Or are you saying you are going to fill it with dirt and put 1/2" hardware cloth over that to keep out digging predators? No air exchange will happen in that case.

 

[JoyfulGoats]

Sorry, I wasn't clear. The hardware cloth will be on the ground and then we will add dirt on too of it so that it's more comfortable to walk on. It does usually end up with some parts open though, as you said. There wouldn't be any air exchange when filled, but I was just curious if whether the fact that it was directly on the ground (which maybe could absorb some humidity) helped compared to on a cement floor.

Anyways, I talked about what I was planning to build with my grandpa (who worked in construction), and he said that it won't be strong enough. The biggest it could be to hold up would be 8x8x4'. So if I wanted a shed 10x10x 8ft high, I am back to the cost option. I really don't want to have to go back to a 4' height and have to keep bending down. With my last chicken coop, it was very annoying and I would regularly bump my head. So I'm not sure what I will end up doing... my last shed cost $1600, and I don't want to spend that much again since we will already be spending at least $1400 for the goats + fence, and are having a house built. Ideally, it would be to wait until next year when we are settled in, but I really want to have them this summer.