Holistic Management - benefits

[meadow1view]

Wow ! Great credentials in working in hazmat cleanup and Environmental Health and Safety Manager and I can see where you are comming from by working in the worst of the worst. I too was certified in Environmental Health and Safety and worked in that capacity at an Ag University Vet. Med. Teaching Hospital. I assisted in the design of a new Vet. reasearch (where chemicals and pathogens were studied and handled),housing for research and ill/ injured animals from private farms, and student classroom building where environmental health and safety were of great concern. I also worked at a private serology company for antibody and genetic marker production. My wife worked for a major international Ag. Chemical research station where chemical herbides and pesticides where studied, also where test chemicals were applied and studied at cooperating University farm lands and private farms prior to being certified and marketed. I can assure you that only a tiny amount of these potential chemicals ever reach the marketplace. The problems arrise when our city brethren, wanna be farmers, or just those that do only what is necessary to "keep his posterior out of jail". With an attitude like that by your facility manager ... Why did he keep his job ? On the flip side I have personally been on quite a few farms where they do the right thing in their farming endeavers (also, my wife and I have a number of relatives that farm large corn, wheat, cattle,and hog operations) (I raised many hundreds of sheep and owned a horse breeding farm) , custom ag. herbicide/ pesticide application companies that treat 100,000 acres of farm lands and pest control companies that make sure that all of their emplyees follow all guidelines or they are immediately fired. Returning to the good old days of ancient farming methods would mean that many more people would have to b return to toil in the fields. Today,since many agricultural product producers have great difficulty in finding these type of workers that are willing to work in the fields... food and fiber production will soon deminish. So where will we all be then ? We must find ballance of the old and new.

Question #1 - why did my facility manager keep his job? Because he acted as most top managers do - they are about profit taking, earning awards, and making a name for themselves. The manager above him only cared that he looked good and that "the company" provided a good dividend to its shareholders. That is more the norm today. I agree with:
The problems arrise when our city brethren, wanna be farmers, or just those that do only what is necessary to "keep his posterior out of jail" There are far too many of this kind running around (big and little guy included).

Yes, there are people out there doing a good job - we need more of them though in order to be a more prosperous nation.

When we ask the why questions (and we all need to ask ourselves), we begin to get a deeper picture of who we are, what our motivations are, whether we have good or bad intentions towards our neighbors and countrymen, etc.

Some questions I asked myself several years ago were Do I want to be able to stay in agriculture so I can pass it down to my children? Why am I not very profitable? Why are market prices fluctuating so much (and usually to my detriment)? How can I attain a sense of security for my family(both financial and health)? In seeking the answers to these questions, I began to realize that buying grain, fertilizer, seed, and medications was draining my bank account continually and when I turned to the markets to sell my products, the results were disappointing. Though I could not really control what someone was going to pay me for what I produced (it is determined by the market like everything else), I could control what my costs were. Trying to get rid of the excessive input costs led me to find Holistic Management. My operating budget dropped considerably and I began to enjoy farming, for the first time in my life. Before, it seemed like a job, but now it had become a lifestyle.

As far as finding workers.......one only need look as far as their own family. That is how most small farms operate. It is a family endeavor. And even if it is just you, Holistic actually requires less of your time in a day than conventional farming since you are letting nature/your animals do the work for you. You are more manager and less hired hand.

Hopefully this gets us started and I look forward to your input.

 

[Bossroo]

Another HUGE problem is that there are so many bleeding hearts out there that increasonly try to make pets out of farm animals . Which means thaw shalt not kill for food or any other reason. I have raised/ bred purebred horses for 37 years , first came the convert corn to ethanol to blend with gasoline so that it would burn "cleaner". Which was fine in theory, however our car gave us 28.1 miles to the gallon of gasoline... after the blending of the two, the milage droped to a whopping 22.4. So I am burning more fuel and traveling less miles. Also, the new competition for corn made corn as well as other grains skyrocket in price. My grain prices first almost doubled, then tripled within 2 years. So, how much are we actually saving our precous air and draining our wallets at the same time ? Then came the blockbuster edict where a new law closed all horse slaughter in the good old USA. To send a crippled or otherwise unwanted horse to slaughter , one now has to ship it to Canada or Mexico which now costs more than one is worth. There is a law here where one can't burry any large animal on one's property. One has to have the body creamated ( $800- $ 1200) or disposed of at the rendering plant running at full capacity due to the huge influx of dead dairy cattle . One of my old geldings died of colic out in a 4 acre field on a rainy night. My cost--- $ 275 for an emergency Vet call then euthanacia, then $300 to the rendering plant to dispose of it. Another caused to turn loose one's unwanted horses onto other's property because they can't afford to feed/ care for them fiasco. Which in turn formed new ferral horse herds running around causing great finacial dammage to cattlemen. Then, these feral horses arrived on BLM lands, causing overgrazing of the range lands. Then, these horses were rounded up into corrals and had to be fed with purchased hay, which became quite a burdonsome expense. So they sold these "mustangs" to the public for $ 25 per head. These wammys caused horse sale prices as well as stud fees to plummet ... horses that I was selling between $5,000 - $100,000 ++ almost overnight droped to $1,000 or less . My production costs far exceeded sale prices, and since I cauldn't support a 33 horse hobby ( IRS says to be in the horse business one has to make a profit at least 2 out of 7 years), I was forced to sell out and ended up giving away 6 horses . Next came the do gooders from the " Animal Rescues" groups that desended upon many horse farms under the guise of animal cruelty to seize not only the horses but also the farms as well. One of my friends with over 70 horses was one of these victims ... she was also carring for her aged mother, and suddenly ill with cancer sister. Her resident farm manager and his wife started to embesle farm funds, so she had to fire them. This now overwelmed gal was forsed to not only care for her relatives, but her horses as well. Then learning of her situation, these do gooders decended upon her, seized her horses, and filled a law suit which cost her a small fortune which in turn caused her to fall behind on mortgage payments. Next, this so called rescue group filed a lien on her ranch for feed,housing and Vet trumped up costs for her horses. They ended up with her ranch, home and barns as well as her horses and caused her to have a complete mental breakdown. I personaly know of 3 other breeders that met these similar do gooders and lost their livelyhoods. I would go on , but I am getting too long winded.

 

[meadow1view]

For the sake of clarity, are you connecting the above stories with a certain point that I had made?

 

[redtailgal]

ROARING APPLAUSE!!!!!

Another HUGE problem is that there are so many bleeding hearts out there that increasonly try to make pets out of farm animals . Which means thaw shalt not kill for food or any other reason. I have raised/ bred purebred horses for 37 years , first came the convert corn to ethanol to blend with gasoline so that it would burn "cleaner". Which was fine in theory, however our car gave us 28.1 miles to the gallon of gasoline... after the blending of the two, the milage droped to a whopping 22.4. So I am burning more fuel and traveling less miles. Also, the new competition for corn made corn as well as other grains skyrocket in price. My grain prices first almost doubled, then tripled within 2 years. So, how much are we actually saving our precous air and draining our wallets at the same time ? Then came the blockbuster edict where a new law closed all horse slaughter in the good old USA. To send a crippled or otherwise unwanted horse to slaughter , one now has to ship it to Canada or Mexico which now costs more than one is worth. There is a law here where one can't burry any large animal on one's property. One has to have the body creamated ( $800- $ 1200) or disposed of at the rendering plant running at full capacity due to the huge influx of dead dairy cattle . One of my old geldings died of colic out in a 4 acre field on a rainy night. My cost--- $ 275 for an emergency Vet call then euthanacia, then $300 to the rendering plant to dispose of it. Another caused to turn loose one's unwanted horses onto other's property because they can't afford to feed/ care for them fiasco. Which in turn formed new ferral horse herds running around causing great finacial dammage to cattlemen. Then, these feral horses arrived on BLM lands, causing overgrazing of the range lands. Then, these horses were rounded up into corrals and had to be fed with purchased hay, which became quite a burdonsome expense. So they sold these "mustangs" to the public for $ 25 per head. These wammys caused horse sale prices as well as stud fees to plummet ... horses that I was selling between $5,000 - $100,000 ++ almost overnight droped to $1,000 or less . My production costs far exceeded sale prices, and since I cauldn't support a 33 horse hobby ( IRS says to be in the horse business one has to make a profit at least 2 out of 7 years), I was forced to sell out and ended up giving away 6 horses . Next came the do gooders from the " Animal Rescues" groups that desended upon many horse farms under the guise of animal cruelty to seize not only the horses but also the farms as well. One of my friends with over 70 horses was one of these victims ... she was also carring for her aged mother, and suddenly ill with cancer sister. Her resident farm manager and his wife started to embesle farm funds, so she had to fire them. This now overwelmed gal was forsed to not only care for her relatives, but her horses as well. Then learning of her situation, these do gooders decended upon her, seized her horses, and filled a law suit which cost her a small fortune which in turn caused her to fall behind on mortgage payments. Next, this so called rescue group filed a lien on her ranch for feed,housing and Vet trumped up costs for her horses. They ended up with her ranch, home and barns as well as her horses and caused her to have a complete mental breakdown. I personaly know of 3 other breeders that met these similar do gooders and lost their livelyhoods. I would go on , but I am getting too long winded.

 

[Bridgemoof]

I'd like to hear more about what kind of holistic management practices you both use in regards to your livestock. The topic kind of got lost in the conversation here. BossRoo, we have the same problem with our horses and the "rescue" people running amok, the market in general as it relates to horse slaughter.

But anyways, back to topic, how do you manage your livestock utilizing holistic practices?

What do you do if you have a sick or injured animal?
How do you manage your pastures?
How do you manage parasites?

 

[Bossroo]

In this morning's Vancouver, Wa. newspaper " The Columbian" a citizen advisory panel recomends that the BLM sterilize wild horses to control herds. The BLM estimates that there are 37,000 feral horses on public lands. An additional 47,000 horses have been removed from the rangelands and cared for in holding areas. One can pick up any number of them for $25 and take them off their hands. Since there are now many more horses being turned loose by people that can no longer care for their charges, they become under the false monaker of " mustang" or " wild horse" even tho they are nothing more than feral horses. The BLM spends about 60% of their annual budget just to feed these removed horses. Guess who gets to feed all of these unwanted horses ? Guess who gets to foot the bill to sterilize these feral horses? You guessed it ... YOU and ME ! These same bleeding heart do gooders however have no plans to pay for their good deeds themselves. Now to answer your questions in short/ condensed form ! As for caring for any sick or injured animals ... I learned from my father who was a Vet. and worked at a University Vet. Medicine Teaching Hospital , so I am pretty well versed for most situations. I also cunsult with Vet. , Animal Husbandry, and Range Manaagement/ Horticulture Professors if/ when the need arrises. I also built ( welded myself) all steel standing surgery chute (modeled after the University's with improvements), breeding chute, breeding dummy for collecting semen for AI, etc., the mare & foal barn has 8 stalls ( each is 12' x 24'). I also have a good friend who is a large animal Vet. that comes to the ranch 2-3 times a week during the breeding season and at a moment's notice any time . Since our ranch was gently rolling open cattle range land since 1850's, I have leveled to grade my 20 acres using 3 D9s and dug out draining ditches for upstream gully rainwater run off. Also, I have built a 30' wide training track around the 4 pastures for mares and foals. Since I may have about 20-50 horses at the ranch any point in time, I feed about 130+ tons of hay and about 25 tons of grain per year plus quite a few bales of wood shavings for bedding. That feed is converted to manure plus the wood shavings which I daily ( my oldest grandson calls this poop poop detail and helped me do it since age 4) spread out onto the pastures. I have done so for about 17 years at this ranch . I also employ Roundup to spot treat for star thistle, bull thistle, puncture vine ( invasive new weed from Australia), and stinging nettle, etc.. I use tractors to mow (when needed) pasture grasses during the growing season. Due to the hardpans, type of clay type soils (5 kinds) , minimal annual rainfall ( 6.5"-10" from Nov. to May), then draught ( May- Nov.) and HIGH ( 100*-117*)temperatures which makes the pastures go dormant, the carrying capacity has increased only slightly. Due largely to number of horses as well as restrictive environmental conditions. For parasite control... since I have so many outside mares come in for breeding, I vaccinate all horses as well as give my own horses ( and those outside mares with approval of their owners) a tablespoon of diatomatous earch in their grain dayly for fly control ( after it passes out in the feces and then the fly larva hatch, it slices and dices the maggots). I also, have a parasitic wasp program. Resulting in very few flys. Since I have sold out my equine enterprise, as well as most of the other horsemen in the area, my equine Vet. shut down his own practice and became a partner in a dog/ cat practice.

 

[Bridgemoof]

Interesting BossRoo, we have a similar situation here at our farm.

We have 25 horses, plus 28 sheep, 15 goats on 17 acres. We go through about 125 tons of hay and 50 tons of grain. We do not spread manure, but we do give it away to local gardeners. We bed our stalls with hay as well and layer and only clean them totally out once a month or so.

We have a breeding stallion and we do live covers occasionally, but also do AI with a local equine vet. The client pays for that so our costs are nil. That vet makes good money on the AI's, so he doesn't charge us for any of the consultation we do with him, and we consult A LOT with him, lol, about all of our animals. We rarely have the vets out unless it's an absolute emergency.

Our pastures are not that great, but we do NO chemicals or pesticides. We have calculated that it costs less for us to put out round bales of hay as opposed to trying to get our pastures up to snuff with fertilizers and reseeding and chemicals. We are above our quota for UPA, and the horses do so much damage with foot traffic, it would be a never ending cycle to keep our pastures in good shape. They do have grazing, it's not totally mud, but it's poor quality. There is one weed, the pigweed, that is getting out of control and it looks like I may have to put down some kind of weed killer this spring to combat it before it takes over all the grass. I've spoken with our county extension agent and it seems like that's our only choice. We use the goats to do some weed eating in the pastures as well.

We do plan on getting a manure spreader. Only because our manure pile usually gets bigger than the demand for it. What do you do about the nitrogen content of the soil since you spread manure daily?

We do worm all of our animals as they graze so close to the ground. We don't vaccinate our horses, but we do vaccinate our lambs and kids. Adult sheep and goats don't get vaccinated. We don't have much of an insect problem, I think the poultry has helped with that. The poultry (over 60 chickens, 6 turkeys, 7 pheasants, 4 ducks) free range and eat the leftover grain so that's not wasted either.

We've recycled and reused every material here on the farm. Old fence boards are made into lambing jugs, feeding troughs, chicken roosts, you name it.

 

[meadow1view]

I'd like to hear more about what kind of holistic management practices you both use in regards to your livestock. The topic kind of got lost in the conversation here. BossRoo, we have the same problem with our horses and the "rescue" people running amok, the market in general as it relates to horse slaughter.

But anyways, back to topic, how do you manage your livestock utilizing holistic practices?

What do you do if you have a sick or injured animal?
How do you manage your pastures?
How do you manage parasites?

The specific type of holistic management that I employ is "high density grazing". I usually run a stock density of 250,000 to 300,000 lbs per acre. Some guys do ultra high density grazing which is upwards of 1 million pounds of animal per acre. The way it works is to section your pastures off into temporary paddocks typically using electric tape or electrified netting. At our current farm we are running dorper sheep and dairy goats using the electrified netting. I calculate how many pounds of animal that I am running and convert that into a percentage of the stocking density that I am seeking. For example, if I have 25,000 lbs of sheep and goats, I divide the 25,000 lbs by 250,000lbs and get 10%. I multiply the 10% by the square footage of an acre (43,560) and get 4356 square feet of paddock needed to attain an animal impact of 250,000 lbs/acre. The square root of 4356 is 66 so I know that I need to set up a paddock that is approx. 66 feet by 66 feet to give me the area I desire. You don't actually need to run the numbers once you get used to the paddock size since you will be able to approximate it by eye. I was just showing you how to get started as far as laying out paddock size.

The reasons you want to graze your animals in a smaller paddock versus continuously grazing an entire field are as follows: it causes them to "competitively graze" meaning they will concentrate more on eating rather than just wandering around selecting only the choicest vegetation, limit or eliminate over grazing (overgrazing is NOT a function of the number of animals, it is a function of timing), cause trampling of some vegetation which acts as a soil cover while the paddock is in the recovery stage (which feeds microbial activity as well as shade soil during hot, dry weather), more thoroughly concentrates waste (you do not need a manure spreader on wheels) to be used by the microbes for building soil matter, and it will help break the parasite cycle.

Here is how I manage my animals daily. I move them once a day during most of the growing season provided there is adequate forage in the paddock. If the quantity of vegetation is not sufficient to fill everyone's rumens for the day, I will move them a second time. Typically, during most of the growing season (from mid May to now) there is adequate vegetation for once a day moves. During the early spring and late fall, I will usually move twice per day to ensure that animal performance is not suffering. The key to success with Holistic management (as with any business) is to observe and adapt. Seasons change, animal numbers change, droughts happen, excessive rain happens, etc. As these events occur, you are able to adapt your operation by observing what is happening in the interaction between your animals and the land they live on (symbiosis). This is how nature functions and it is the best blueprint for us to follow since it is a small part of nature that we are trying to manage.

As far as the parasites are concerned- typically 21 days will break the parasite cycle so if you are moving your animals on a daily basis and not returning them to the same paddock for at least 21 days, it greatly minimizes their exposure to parasites. Also, susceptibility to parasites is a function of health. The healthier your animals, the more likely they will be able to handle a parasite load without undue stress. We have not used dewormers for several years now and everyone knows that sheep and goats are highly susceptible to worms (particularly the barber pole worm). The rested paddocks will also allow the grass a "recovery period" before being grazed again. This will help protect against overgrazing and killing your pastures.

Treating sick or injured animals. We do not use medications or vaccines. Any animal that can not thrive on the sun, water, and vegetation that its system was designed to symbiotically interact with is culled from the herd. All animal populations have sick animals - it is a fact of nature. In fact, the lowest animals in the social order, almost without fail, tend to be the ones with a propensity for getting sick. As you already know, goats have a very strict social hierarchy and the lowest on the totem pole are the ones we always watch out for. We try to provide adequate room in the barn for feeding in the winter as well as bedding down at night so as to limit the stress on the more subordinate does. The sheep seem to get along well enough without much stress as their hierarchy is less well defined. If you have an injury (cut on a leg or gash on a head), apply sugar or honey. When cells are supplied with adequate energy (glucose and fructose are our primary energy sources) they can quickly repair themselves. Also try to keep the affected area bandaged since a warm, moist environment also helps quicken recovery time.

As far as nutritional requirements: goats require the greatest amount, then sheep, then cattle. I do not know where horses fall in the equation since I have only managed a few. That is a major reason why there are a lot of people on this forum asking about goat feeding and illnesses - they require a more narrow range of management due to their natural biochemistry and physiology.

Each year, you should notice an increase in pasture production (usually the first year or two are slight gains as the pasture and microbes begin adapting to your management and then production increases more greatly). We moved here to the lower Midwest (Ozarks) where the land is actually not great for growing pastures. The land is rocky, full of clay and we have typically hot and dry summers. Holistic is the only management system that would have allowed me to stay in business. This year, in Missouri, a lot of our farmers went out of business because they couldn't afford the input costs of hay and grain while going through the worst drought in 50 years. I grazed all of our animals on pasture (55 head on 7 acres) since mid March and will not have to feed hay for about another 3 weeks. This is not to my credit - it all goes to Holistic. I have only been on this farm for 2 years now so I am not realizing anywhere near its fullest potential. The previous owner was an elderly lady who had let the land go fallow for several years. It was a bit of a mess when we pulled in. If we had been here for 5 years or more, I am sure I wouldn't be looking at a hay bale until the beginning of January. At our last farm, where we raised Red angus cattle, Boer goats, dairy goats, and dorper sheep, I was not feeding hay until the 2nd week of January.

And I had some neighbors give me a mocking look when they saw me running my animals in paddocks, but I felt better when I was watching my animals grazing on green grass and they were complaining about going through their stockpile of hay in the middle of summer. Holistic is not MIG or merely a pasture rotation system. It is a paradigm shift from just throwing feed at an animal to understanding the needs of your animals and how they desire to interact with the land and how it can become more productive.

I could add a lot more, but I believe this gives a general overview of our management scheme. I will provide a few links about what others are doing under Holistic.

Best wishes.

http://holisticmanagement.org/
http://www.countryworldnews.com/news-archives/CTX/2005/ct0707ranch.php
http://paicinesranch.com/index.php
http://bigbluffranch.com/our-cows-and-sheep.html