Possible CL Contamination - Goats

[KidMandy]

Hi Everyone,

We took in a buck a few weeks ago to mate with our doe. He was from a relatively trusted farm, as they are well known in the community and are a source of goat milk for the local large-scale goat cheese producer.

When we picked him up, the farmer noted he had discovered a 'lump' on the side of the buck's neck. It was quite large (almost as big as my hand) and looked like swelling. He assumed the buck had injured himself and was not particularly concerned.

The lump has not gone down since we brought the buck home, and this morning it burst, sending puss all over the goat's house, bedding, water, etc. We have separated him as best we can (we don't have a lot of extra space) and my husband is cleaning out the house, putting down new bedding, checking over our goats, etc.

I have a call in to our vet to see if there is anything we can do to protect our goats. We have three - a wethered buck, and two does, both are pregnant. I have read that CL is contagious, but cannot seem to find out how it spreads - through the air, by the puss being ingested, simply by being touched by it - or if it's contagious to humans, or if the babies being carried could already have it.

If anyone has experience with this, please tell me what we should be doing. I also have a call in to the farmer who gave us the buck to begin with. I have a hard time believing that it wasn't already present in his herd. CL can't just show up out of the blue, can it?

Thank you for any help you can give.

 

[BrownSheep]

CL is generally transmitted through contact with the puss. If I remember correctly it is possible for humans to contract it but it isn't common occurrence. I also think kids can contract if via milk.

I would test the buck to make certain it wasn't just an abscess. I think milk producers have to test for CL on a fairly regular basis. Where exactly on the neck was the abscess?

Sorry, I'm not more help. It's been a while since I've studied CL

 

[babsbag]

UGH. Get some of that puss and get it tested. Or if you can't do that get a blood draw and send it in. It is imperative to find out if it is CL. My buck had a real ugly abscess on his neck, it was the size of a softball. I had it lanced and tested and it was not CL. Fortunately he was in a quarantine pen just in case.

It is transferred through contact with the puss and yes people can get it but not common at all. It is not passed through the milk and milk producers do not test for it. It can live in the soil for years and in wood and other porous items. If the abscess burst in an area where you have your does then they have been exposed but the puss has to find a break in their skin to enter the blood stream, unfortunately that is pretty common. Whatever pen he was in is now contaminated and will not be clean for years unless you bring in new soil or scrape that soil out. There is no way to remove it or neutralize it on a porous surface.

You have to get him tested and if it is CL then you need to start testing your animals in about 6 months, it takes that long for them to test positive. You may never see an abscess and they can still be positive. But let's not go down that path until you get that buck tested.

Sorry about this. It will be a long few weeks. If your does are bred the kids are fine.

 

[KidMandy]

Thank you for the replies. The vet came out and said our description of the abscess as being soft, squishy, and warm to the touch, does not match with the typical CL abscess. It's also not in a typical CL location, and the puss was more milky/puddingy yellow and cheese-smelling, as opposed to thicker, like cream cheese.

We have had it tested, though. I am really hoping it's negative.

 

[babsbag]

Good to know that you are hopefully in the clear. If you have a CL free herd I would never take in a goat with an abscess anywhere on it's body. Too risky unless said goat has a clear test in the last month and even then I would be leery.

Glad you are having it tested.

 

[KidMandy]

Good to know that you are hopefully in the clear. If you have a CL free herd I would never take in a goat with an abscess anywhere on it's body. Too risky unless said goat has a clear test in the last month and even then I would be leery.

Glad you are having it tested.

I did have reservations about bringing him home. At the time, he was our only option, though, as they are tight with bio-security and couldn't allow us to bring our doe to them, and we hadn't been able to find anyone else to borrow a buck. If it turns out that it isn't CL, we will likely keep this guy. He is a nice Alpine with a good temperament. I just wish he didn't have horns!

 

[Southern by choice]

I did have reservations about bringing him home. At the time, he was our only option, though, as they are tight with bio-security and couldn't allow us to bring our doe to them, and we hadn't been able to find anyone else to borrow a buck. If it turns out that it isn't CL, we will likely keep this guy. He is a nice Alpine with a good temperament. I just wish he didn't have horns!

I hope it is not CL
It was irresponsible of them to lease you the buck without them testing the lump or treating before they sent him onto your property. Secondly I don't buy the bio-security line... here is why.
The buck is exposed to a great deal going off property and coming back onto theirs... are they a tested herd? What do they test for? Are you a tested herd? What are you tested for? Did they even ask? Do they have documentation?

 

[OneFineAcre]

I hope it does turn out to not be CL. Your vet is most likely correct.

Where on the goats neck was the abscess?

We've had two goats get an abscess on their jaw. They can get an abscessed tooth or salivary gland. Both times the vet said it wasn't CL when he saw where it was located and when he saw the puss. We tested anyway and both times it was negative.

I hope you get the same outcome.

 

[Sweetened]

I'm going to throw this out there at risk of taking some heat. I have researched CL quite a bit as I have had two does that get a lump that comes and goes on their wattle but it has never burst or opened up. Even the BEST of the BEST producers can have CL in their herds and never know it, whether they test for it or not. A common thing out my way is to see people advertising their herds as "Certified CL free." I found out, from doing a few calls around for certification, you CANNOT, in North America, be certified CL free. CL free simply means there have been no outward occurrence of lesions OR any lumps/bumps/humps have tested negative for CL. Abscesses can be internal and never present outwardly. Goats who have ZERO history or suspected exposure can form the abscesses at any time due to immune responses and other infections while exposed to goats who have it and have never shown symptoms. IMHO, if you have ever bought an auction goat or from someone who has, the chances of it occurring on your farm sometime, somewhere are very high. From my understanding, it's one of those things if you own goats long enough, you will see it.

Your hubby is doing the right thing! I have treated the lumps on the does wattles that have had them with topical oregano oil, and the lump is gone in days -- I suspect they catch them on the feeder, but I don't know. When I talked to my vet and a couple other people, they said unless it bursts, its best to leave it closed for now, as opting to lance it allows the disease to spread.

My fingers are crossed for you! Head up and don't panic.

 

[Southern by choice]

I'm going to throw this out there at risk of taking some heat. I have researched CL quite a bit as I have had two does that get a lump that comes and goes on their wattle but it has never burst or opened up. Even the BEST of the BEST producers can have CL in their herds and never know it, whether they test for it or not. A common thing out my way is to see people advertising their herds as "Certified CL free." I found out, from doing a few calls around for certification, you CANNOT, in North America, be certified CL free. CL free simply means there have been no outward occurrence of lesions OR any lumps/bumps/humps have tested negative for CL. Abscesses can be internal and never present outwardly. Goats who have ZERO history or suspected exposure can form the abscesses at any time due to immune responses and other infections while exposed to goats who have it and have never shown symptoms. IMHO, if you have ever bought an auction goat or from someone who has, the chances of it occurring on your farm sometime, somewhere are very high. From my understanding, it's one of those things if you own goats long enough, you will see it.

Your hubby is doing the right thing! I have treated the lumps on the does wattles that have had them with topical oregano oil, and the lump is gone in days -- I suspect they catch them on the feeder, but I don't know. When I talked to my vet and a couple other people, they said unless it bursts, its best to leave it closed for now, as opting to lance it allows the disease to spread.

My fingers are crossed for you! Head up and don't panic.

You are right great producers especially meat goats often have CL in their herds. As far as "Certified" that wouldn't make any sense because it can show up after exposure etc.
We test every year and advertise... "Tested Negative" we give month and year.... It is the best we can do for our herd with what is available.
In our region we are seeing many people list their goats as tested but they don't even know the testing and often don't have documentation...

There are times goats get abscesses and surely they are not always CL.