Proven vs Unproven: Pros and Cons

[Ms. Research]

I've been reading lots about breeding rabbits because I plan to start up in the Spring of 2012 with purchasing my first breeding rabbits.

This was posted as a suggestion on the Meat Rabbit Recommendation and thought it was sound advise.

I started with meat rabbits last year. My best advice is to avoid the temptation to get breeding age rabbits and buy your animals young. They will grow up with you and be used to you handling them. It will be less likely for them to bite, scratch or otherwise tear you up that way. I have the scars to prove that scared rabbits can tear you up in a heartbeat. Our own litters that we bred and raised are much more docile and easy going. Just my two cents....good luck! Oh, and we have Californian rabbits and we love them.

Shannon

I've been back and forth thinking whether I should get Proven does, but Shannon makes sense when it comes to raising your breeders from kits. I know it is frustrating sometimes with unproven does, (read a LOT here about that) but with rabbits it does take out the stress in life IF they know their handlers.

So would like to hear the pros and cons of getting "Green" Rabbits.

Would appreciate any input. Thanks!

 

[oneacrefarm]

Ms. Research,

The first rabbits we got were unproven, breeding age rabbits. All three of the does produced good litters with the first mating to the unproven buck. I don't worry too much about proven vs. unproven anymore. Most rabbits can and do reproduce easily, so temperament is more important to me initially. All the older ones have to be handled very carefully or I will wind up bleeding. The ones we raised are much easier and I don't really worry about them scratching me because they don't really.

Thanks for post, it is always nice to hear that I have helped someone out in some small way!

Shannon

 

[Ms. Research]

It's nice that you share what you know with others. I've also looked at your set up as well (on another thread). Thanks for sharing that as well.

I'll worry about temperament more than proven. I'm not setting up a HUGE rabbitry. I'm not RUSHING for kits, so raising kits to breeding age will suit me. When the time comes, if doe or buck doesn't prove, then I guess I'll be learning how to make rabbit stew. And start all over again.

 

[Beekissed]

The good thing about rabbits is that you can breed yourself into a good set of does real quick and in a hurry. Say you get a set of young ones, raise them for temperament, breed them and find that one out of three isn't a good mother/producer/hardy.

You then eliminate her from your breeding and replace her with a doe kit from the other does. Replace your buck or keep two bucks so you won't breed back to offspring if you are trying to avoid it.

This can go on exponentially until you get the meaty/productive/good mothering/sweet temperament does you want and then just keep building that line as you go along. It doesn't take long with rabbits to build a good warren.

 

[Ms. Research]

The good thing about rabbits is that you can breed yourself into a good set of does real quick and in a hurry. Say you get a set of young ones, raise them for temperament, breed them and find that one out of three isn't a good mother/producer/hardy.

You then eliminate her from your breeding and replace her with a doe kit from the other does. Replace your buck or keep two bucks so you won't breed back to offspring if you are trying to avoid it.

This can go on exponentially until you get the meaty/productive/good mothering/sweet temperament does you want and then just keep building that line as you go along. It doesn't take long with rabbits to build a good warren.

Thanks so much. Truly appreciate the input.

 

[bunnylovincowgirl]

That's exciting to hear that you are considering getting breeding rabbits! Do you have a breed picked out that you like?

I think that one of the biggest advantages to buying a proven doe is that she has already had her first litter. First-time does can be inexperienced and lose their entire litter. I think it happens more often with small breeds than large ones, but there's a study on the Nature Trail website where she looked at her data and found that she could expect babies to survive from a first-time mom only about 50% of the time. So if a doe has already raised a litter, you don't have that concern. That said, many first time mom's do a great job.

A doe that has had a litter in itself isn't necessarily of value, but if you can see some of her offspring and their quality, you can get an idea of what she produces. Not all does reproduce their good qualities.

Best of luck to you! Oh and here's the Nature Trail post: www.thenaturetrail.com/blog/2007/03/first-time-moms.html

 

[Ms. Research]

That's exciting to hear that you are considering getting breeding rabbits! Do you have a breed picked out that you like?

I think that one of the biggest advantages to buying a proven doe is that she has already had her first litter. First-time does can be inexperienced and lose their entire litter. I think it happens more often with small breeds than large ones, but there's a study on the Nature Trail website where she looked at her data and found that she could expect babies to survive from a first-time mom only about 50% of the time. So if a doe has already raised a litter, you don't have that concern. That said, many first time mom's do a great job.

A doe that has had a litter in itself isn't necessarily of value, but if you can see some of her offspring and their quality, you can get an idea of what she produces. Not all does reproduce their good qualities.

Best of luck to you! Oh and here's the Nature Trail post: www.thenaturetrail.com/blog/2007/03/first-time-moms.html

Back and forth with either Mini Rex or Holland Lop. Still have time to really think it through. Appreciate the input and will definitely go to the site you posted.

 

[oneacrefarm]

That's exciting to hear that you are considering getting breeding rabbits! Do you have a breed picked out that you like?

I think that one of the biggest advantages to buying a proven doe is that she has already had her first litter. First-time does can be inexperienced and lose their entire litter. I think it happens more often with small breeds than large ones, but there's a study on the Nature Trail website where she looked at her data and found that she could expect babies to survive from a first-time mom only about 50% of the time. So if a doe has already raised a litter, you don't have that concern. That said, many first time mom's do a great job.

A doe that has had a litter in itself isn't necessarily of value, but if you can see some of her offspring and their quality, you can get an idea of what she produces. Not all does reproduce their good qualities.

Best of luck to you! Oh and here's the Nature Trail post: www.thenaturetrail.com/blog/2007/03/first-time-moms.html

That website is a great source of information! I scoured it when I first started getting interested in rabbits. We were blessed, in that our first three moms did great and took care/fed the babies with no issues. Unfortunately, I had to put them all down due to Pasteurella. So, now I am building my herd again. Thankfully, I have a litter from the buck with a new doe that stayed healthy and they are very sweet natured. That doe, Roxie, did great with her first litter. I also have one proven doe and buck from another breeder and several first timers. They are all due at varying dates in November. We bred all of them since we have not had a litter since July. So, this will be a great experiment in proven vs. unproven...I have three first timers that I don't hold out too much hope for....I call them "The Three Furies", they are very squirrelly does. I will be surprised if they do well with their first litters...

Shannon

 

[DKRabbitry]

Another thing to watch out for is why proven animals are being sold. Are they still producing good or is there anything "wrong" with them as to why they are being sold? Even with proven animals, you are still taking a chance. I got a beautiful satin doe that had produced a couple good litters with show worthy animals, just to get her to my place and have her kill every litter she had. I tried her twice, gave her to a friend, she continued to kill all her babies. My friend got 1 kit raised out of her that she managed to foster with another doe. He is a show-stopper for sure. Just beautiful, but what a headache to get him. She has since been culled.

When I look for breeding stock, I like to get younger rabbits (6 months and under) that come from large litters and have good mothers. That way they can settle in here for a while before being bred, and hopefully they have gained some mothering instincts from their dams in terms of the does. If they lose the first litter, it isn't so much a big deal to me because we are not high producers. We will just breed her back and wait another month.

 

[oneacrefarm]

Another thing to watch out for is why proven animals are being sold. Are they still producing good or is there anything "wrong" with them as to why they are being sold? Even with proven animals, you are still taking a chance. I got a beautiful satin doe that had produced a couple good litters with show worthy animals, just to get her to my place and have her kill every litter she had. I tried her twice, gave her to a friend, she continued to kill all her babies. My friend got 1 kit raised out of her that she managed to foster with another doe. He is a show-stopper for sure. Just beautiful, but what a headache to get him. She has since been culled.

When I look for breeding stock, I like to get younger rabbits (6 months and under) that come from large litters and have good mothers. That way they can settle in here for a while before being bred, and hopefully they have gained some mothering instincts from their dams in terms of the does. If they lose the first litter, it isn't so much a big deal to me because we are not high producers. We will just breed her back and wait another month.

I totally agree with you on this....you will hear of folks ending up with someone's worn out 4yo doe that was advertised as "Proven" because they were too new to know any better. I would rather take a chance with a good tempered youngster that comes from good stock myself.

Shannon