Relation between Weeds and Soil

[WildRoseBeef]

Going out on a walk out in the hay field and the pasture, I bit of a "weird" question occured to me. Particularly about dandelions, but this could also be with other weeds like lambsquarters, stinging nettle, chickweed, pigweed and stinkweed. So the question goes like this:

What is the significance of dandelions (or other weeds including those listed above) in relation to soil fertility? Do dandelions (or other weeds including those listed above) indicate lack of a particular nutrient in the soil or do they indicate good soil?

 

[Farmer Kitty]

I've been taught that they indicate a poor stand of hay, grass, etc. In particular that the stand has thinned out and allowed room for the weeds to grow.

I would think that the more weeds the better the nutrients due to the fact that any plant needs the nutrients to grow. Just my opinion.

 

[WildRoseBeef]

So, in other words if you have a field full of dandelions which have either choked out the grass stand it indicates that the soil is still viable for grass to grow even though it's chuck full of weeds? I agree on the overgrazing concept; more pressure from the animals on the weeds thins them out which allows more room for the grass to grow.

But in relation to soil fertility, like lack of or enriched with minerals like phosphorous, calcium, nitrogen, potassium, magnesium, etc., is what I was wondering about. Or even pH.

Or maybe it's because of a whole bunch of different variables all co-mingled together?

And then how do you explain the sudden boom in population of dandelions in the lawn? :/

 

[Farmer Kitty]

Thin lawn.

They say that the dandelions take hold because the stand is thin--whatever the reason (winter kill, over grazing, etc). Not that they choke the stand out. As for nutrients and PH. Each type of crop, alfalfa, clover, timothy, corn, grass, weeds, etc. varies in what they need.

 

[Thewife]

In my quest to make this place grow grass (and flowers and food), here is what I have learned!
Dandelions, will grow where ever their evil seeds can find a micro grain of soil. If the soil is bad, they do good. If the soil is good, you get monster dandelions! Supposedly you can choke them out, if the grass is allowed to grow X inches tall (I can't remember how many is X)

 

[WildRoseBeef]

Thin lawn.

They say that the dandelions take hold because the stand is thin--whatever the reason (winter kill, over grazing, etc). Not that they choke the stand out. As for nutrients and PH. Each type of crop, alfalfa, clover, timothy, corn, grass, weeds, etc. varies in what they need.

Okay...

But yeah, in the pasture there's places where the grass is too thick there's no dandelions, but on the east-facing hills and high spots where the grass is a little thin there's a few dandelions popping up.

But my question wasn't about thin stands, more like soil quality..

 

[Farmer Kitty]

In my quest to make this place grow grass (and flowers and food), here is what I have learned!
Dandelions, will grow where ever their evil seeds can find a micro grain of soil. If the soil is bad, they do good. If the soil is good, you get monster dandelions! Supposedly you can choke them out, if the grass is allowed to grow X inches tall (I can't remember how many is X)

It would have to be awfully tall as they grow up with the hay fields and my lawn!

To really check the quality of the soil you need to take a sample and take/send it in to be tested. I'm not sure if a weed check could give you a good answer as they tend to grow every where, especially where you want them the least.

 

[Thewife]

I don't know much, this place has been logged, top soils scraped off in some places, over grazed in most places and over sprayed with weed killers. (I did not do it), this is what I have found so far.

If I find healthy nettles, I know there is good soil under there, that will grow good grass!
If I find foxglove, I know the soil is OK, but any grass grown there will probably dry up early in the summer.
If I can wipe out a BIG blackberry patch, the soil left behind, grows good grass!
If I find the small stinky weed I have no clue what it's called, I know nothing will grow there and I need to dump some manure!

 

[Imissmygirls]

My big bro the soil scientist tells me that, nationally, fertile limestone soil is found where natural stands of cedar trees are abundant - or vice versa. I should ask him your question!

 

[kstaven]

Nutrient depleted and acidic soil will grow some great weeds and really lousy grass. Grass will be sparse and pale. Time for some soil testing.

You may find there is little fibrous matter to hold nutrients and moisture. If this is the case fertilizing is a real waste. It just washes away quickly and goes deeper than the root system of the grass you want to feed.