Farmerjan's journal - Weather

[farmerjan]

Yes, they lose the ear tags.... catch them on something and can tear them out. Sometimes tear the ear, sometimes just breaks the back off or the back(button) stays in and the front of the eartag breaks.... The plastic sometimes get brittle and they break... We regularly retag cows ... one reason why we put 2 tags in ... so if they lose one, they still have another...
Another reason I am seriously thinking to go to freeze branding..... several bulls we have bought have been freeze branded and I honestly like it. I would still put in ear tags as young calves... then freeze brand anything we keep past weaning...and for cows etc... You have to be registered with the state to have a "brand" but to just put numbers on an animal is not required to be registered. Ear tags are easier to see when you are just looking at their heads and such,,, but freeze brands can not be "cut out of their ear" like a tag can be... they can't catch it on anything and they can be traced if the animal is killed and the hide seen from the inside, like a hot brand.... although a hot brand is easier to see... all the western states have brand laws, cattle must have brand inspections once traveling across state lines.... and some will have several brands on them if they are sold several times... A guy in OR just bought some "one and done" bred old cows, and they had a brand from his neighbor among other ones... and this guy went on and branded them with his registered brand... to prove ownership....and they will be going to slaughter in the fall when he weans off the calves...

They had several wander miles away last year with the horrible fires that took down fences for hundreds of miles... just got back a couple of calves, now nearly yearlings, that they figured followed some other cattle when they fled the fires... When these cattle are on the BLM allotments, some do manage to roam and get with other cattle... it happens... but last year there were cattle mixed up for miles and miles.... All his calves get branded and worked before they go out to pasture for the summer... It is a way of life out in many western states.

 

[SageHill]

Yes, they lose the ear tags.... catch them on something and can tear them out. Sometimes tear the ear, sometimes just breaks the back off or the back(button) stays in and the front of the eartag breaks.... The plastic sometimes get brittle and they break... We regularly retag cows ... one reason why we put 2 tags in ... so if they lose one, they still have another...
Another reason I am seriously thinking to go to freeze branding..... several bulls we have bought have been freeze branded and I honestly like it. I would still put in ear tags as young calves... then freeze brand anything we keep past weaning...and for cows etc... You have to be registered with the state to have a "brand" but to just put numbers on an animal is not required to be registered. Ear tags are easier to see when you are just looking at their heads and such,,, but freeze brands can not be "cut out of their ear" like a tag can be... they can't catch it on anything and they can be traced if the animal is killed and the hide seen from the inside, like a hot brand.... although a hot brand is easier to see... all the western states have brand laws, cattle must have brand inspections once traveling across state lines.... and some will have several brands on them if they are sold several times... A guy in OR just bought some "one and done" bred old cows, and they had a brand from his neighbor among other ones... and this guy went on and branded them with his registered brand... to prove ownership....and they will be going to slaughter in the fall when he weans off the calves...

They had several wander miles away last year with the horrible fires that took down fences for hundreds of miles... just got back a couple of calves, now nearly yearlings, that they figured followed some other cattle when they fled the fires... When these cattle are on the BLM allotments, some do manage to roam and get with other cattle... it happens... but last year there were cattle mixed up for miles and miles.... All his calves get branded and worked before they go out to pasture for the summer... It is a way of life out in many western states.

When I shot for PBR I got to know some of the bull contractors. One of the contractors out here would have me come out when they'd bring in the cows and calves --big deal, cowboys from around the county came to help. Took all day - vaccinate, castrate, and hot brand.
Makes sense the ear tags can fall out, esp with plastic being what it is.

 

[farmerjan]

DS had to go deal with the neighbors pigs down at the BV farm.... he had talked to them because the renters are taking pictures of the pigs out tearing up the grass in the field every day and sending the pics to DS... documenting this... because the neighbor won't keep them in... Well I guess they got into the front yard today there... DS said this morning that he had a serious discussion with the guy about the pigs out constantly... and the other neighbors complaining... and that they are costing us money by tearing up the grass... then I guess he got a call after we got the cows moved this morning... well, I guess it was after 1 when we got finished.

Anyway... I had texted and asked if he was going to do anything at the barn this afternoon, and if he wanted to take a load of the cow/calf pairs to BV on his way "home" this evening... he texted me back and said he was dealing with the pig situation in BV but he wanted to be at the barn by 5 to get the ones in from across the driveway to the barn so we did not have to deal with them in the morning..
I went to the barn, he had just gotten there... we closed the gates across the driveway, and he took the 4-wheeler and went up in the field and we got most of them down... got them into the barn then reopened the gate and got the 3 that tend to not want to come to call... 3 calves had come down on their own and went down the alley to the barn... the other 3 came in pretty easy.

Sorted out 8 cows to go to BV... one heifer that had lost her calf that I wanted to rebreed... and worked all the calves through the chute... double tagged (both ears) the calves and all the cows had 2 tags... matched the 7 calves to the cows... and sorted out 2 that are bagging right up so ought to calve shortly... and then there are 6 or 7 that I want the vet to recheck. Several were confirmed preg... and should be showing close... and I think that DS has finally come to the realization that they need to go if open... There are a couple that I think slipped their calf... we had that one cow confirmed to that Theileria tick disease... and it can cause abortion although that is not the primary symptom... our cow did not look or act sick... but I just had a feeling... and she was positive... and she got sold... I am thinking that there might be a few more that slipped...maybe partially due to it.. ????
There is one cow with a calf that is walking with a little "hitch"... and one of my bought cows that has a mediocre calf, bad udder, usually not alot of milk when the calf could really use it after 3 months... and is old... these 2 will go to another pasture and maybe some odd balls... ones that will get on the trailer and take a ride to town after this summer and the calf has grown... I can't complain... I had planned for the cow to be a "one and done" and instead she has her 3rd calf here... These 2 will get a summer of grass and grazing, and then take a final ride in the fall... I am sure there will be a few more before it is over with...

But, anyway, there are 2 more with calves to go to the pasture with the ones he took this evening... PLUS the 4 or 5 that I can get in at snyder's in the next couple days... they will have to be worked and double tagged also... and 2 that I put back up in the field that are uddered up and should calve any day...

He was by himself at the barn this afternoon, and things went pretty smoothly too. Sorting everyone out, moving them around to where it will make it easier to just get them in the barn in the morning to be ready for the vet... I think 10 a.m.... DS will go call them into the barn in the morning with feed and the ones that have been there will come right in... plus the others all know what a feed bucket is for, and come to call... so should be able to get them in fairly easily... we will sort the calves off and have the first group of cows ready to go... those are the ones we moved this morning... then get the other ones sorted off, and run them through... we will deal with who we are putting where after the vet leaves.. he has one bull calf that is on my one cow... that DS can only find one nut... NICEST CALF IMAGINABLE.... but he wants the vet to cut him... which is fine with me... And for once the signs are good too... just going into the new moon... so least amount of blood flow through the body... We had thought to keep him for a replacement bull.... but with very small scurs and now only 1 nut... nope.... NO WAY....

So, I finally came on after we put the 2 back up in the calving field... and the others at the barn out... and the 8/7 in the alley to load on the trailer... and I came on home...

Still no signs of the bull... DS has talked to several guys... everyone knows we are looking for him... and most everyone is honest enough to call us if they wind up with a strange bull .... haven't talked to everyone around with cattle yet... but word will get around.... GRRRR...

Time to go to bed... Ate some clam chowder.. it is damp out even though the sun was trying to show through a little about 7 pm. Need some sleep... going to be a long day tomorrow...

 

[Baymule]

Your bull went on a tour of the area. Maybe miles and miles away. Hot branding might be a good idea. When I was married to my ex, we had cattle, his family had cattle, and we hot branded. Since we had a nice lot and chute, neighbors ran their cattle to our place to hot brand their cattle too. All the oldsters on ex’s family have died, he is sickly and now leases the land to a neighbor with cattle. Plus he was always lazy. Without the family to work cattle as a group, he quit.

 

[Mini Horses]

Hope the bill comes home. But if he found some cows, well it'll be a few days. Looks like you'll get more of this rain a few more days. Will here thru Fri.

 

[farmerjan]

Decent day today, wet weather not withstanding... It was cloudy at 7, started raining by 8... light gentle rain... Rained most all day, few times it stopped for 1/2 hr or so... been very soft rain all day. Still raining this evening... supposed to rain off and on all night, into tomorrow morning... then maybe cloudy most of the day and into Thursday... Some more rain later on Friday... then spotty showers Sat and then maybe some clearing off... WARMING coming back???? It has been 50-57 today... CHILLY.....all day today.

21 out of 22 pregnant from the group we moved to the barn... and the open one is OLD, and will have the summer at pasture with her calf and the other 2 old ones, that I had mentioned... and then they and their calves will get sold. Also moving a steer calf there that is just not doing much... and will see how the last group does next Monday for the final preg check. Might have one or 2 more to go there.

The recheck ones were a mixed bag... 4 were still pregnant... Good.... but they will wind up being fall calving cows. Probably come fresh in July/Aug..... The 2 out there that are bagging up should have calves within a couple days... They will go out to pasture after they calve and calves get worked. The 2 charolais he bought, turns out the heifer is NOT bred... but the one that we thought may have slipped a calf is actually 2 months bred..... One other that was preg is open and will get sold, along with my old cow that was open... and GF and I talked about another cow ... she had a crippled calf that died... he has been feeding her all this time... and when we put the 2nd tag in her ear and DS put her out in the lot to move her up to go with a couple cows... to go out to pasture to get bred... she kept daring him; threatening him by turning around when he was trying to get her to go up the alley... wanting to come after him...... and I told him that he was crazy to keep her... seems cow did the same to DS another time when GF was around... and I said she should get sold... and GF told him she should get sold... and so he finally cut her out and put her in the pen with the other 2 to get shipped. The one heifer that should have calved and slipped it, is open, and is going back out with the bull.... and the one off my longhorn that DS said slipped the calf...came back in heat and seems she is now 60 days bred... he had a bull out there with the cows in the peterbilt field, until they started calving and then he took the bull out... seems my heifer must've come in heat and he caught her... so she is rebred... this will be her last chance and also for the other heifer.....
There were no big surprises except for "L" (my 1/2 longhorn) as I never thought about her getting caught by the bull that was in that field for 2 months... sadly he did not catch the other one...
So he moved the 3 with calves and the steer to that pasture.... then was coming back to the barn to get another load to take down to the BV farm near her house...... He is taking 2 with calves that are only 45 days, from the group of 21 preg... everyone else is 3-5 months... but these 2 have the youngest calves... taking the 2 char down there also... plus L, who is 60 days, the open heifer to rebreed, and 2 other heifers he didn't have room in the trailer for yesterday... so had another "load" to take today. They will e getting caught up and moved out before they are due.... need to be caught up and moved by Oct... so that should be doable... although I know how he doesn't get things done when they should be....

Put the rest back out in the 1st barn field/lot there for the day/night. He has to decide where he is going to put them as the calves could/should stay on most of them for another 3 months or so... unless he is going to pull some to sell...... I think he is waiting to do the other group next week, before he decides who is going where... Got to be somewhere that we can pull calves off by mid-Aug so they get 45-60 days rest. There are 5 or 6 that are 3-3 1/2 months, the rest in there were 4-5... and they have the biggest calves... Might stick them out in the peterbilt field for the time being and get them out of the barn lot.... Got the whole fence up along that alley... just have to hang the gate... They could have that to graze for a week... and maybe he will split them into the 3 month group and the 4-5 month group... I don't know...

Overall it was a good preg check... especially on the group of 22....

Have a line on the bull... but it is with the one neighbor that is not one you want to deal with... the son is pretty honest but the father is not.. and another neighbor that told DS that he didn't know of a stray bull, outright lied since this father/son pair has cattle there... and the son said there was a stray bull and the father claims that it is their bull...So this neighbor told DS that he didn't think anything of it because the father told him it was their bull... at least the son is more decent and honest... and hopefully will honor having the bull checked... He knows it is not their bull.... This bull should have tattoo's in his ear.. so have got to find the papers from the sale to prove the bull is ours. The father part of the father/son is a back stabbing lying sob... you can't trust them but the son has seemed to be an honest type.... and acts decent.....
I've got to dig for the papers... hope I made copies, DS kept the originals.... all I need are the tattoo numbers of the 2 bulls....
Told DS that I think he needs to talk to the friend that works at the VA Tech research farm here local... about doing freeze branding...It will be alot of work to do everything... but once the cows are done, then we would only have to do the calves every year... and anything we buy....including any bulls we purchase. Makes it pretty hard to claim a stray that way, unless you have proof you bought one with a brand on it... and I record any that we buy and a couple have had freeze brands and I write it all down.

So that is that... Now to testing... have the 2x herd Wed aft/Thurs morning. Have to take them the meters in the morning, for them to set up. Back at 3 to test and back Thursday morning.... Have one scheduled for Friday eve... and now am doing one Sat morning...planned to do them one afternoon but..... their milker just broke his arm yesterday... so the boss wants me to test when he is milking on a morning milking as the guy milking evenings for now, does not speak good english and does not do a great job but right now he is all they have. I will go set up Friday eve after I get done testing, since I will be fairly close to the farm... 10-12 miles away... because I am not going there extra early to set up Sat morning... they start milking at 3:30 a.m. YUCK......Bad enough I will have to get up at 2 to leave by 2:30 a.m. to get there to test at 3:30....NOT getting up an extra hour early to set up there before milking..... it will get them done. Normally I only do them afternoons because of the milking hours...
I have 1 more that needs to get done... and the 500+ cow herd is tenatively scheduled for NEXT Wed.... and a new month starts over again... I thought about trying to do one Thursday aft... but I won't get everything done early enough Thursday to get to this farm... was going to do them Sat aft... but don't think I want to try to rush to get there by noon to set up because they start milking at 1:30 in the afternoon....I would be too tired and "cranky" after getting up at 2 that morning... so will wait to do them the first part of the next week.

 

[Mini Horses]

Feast or famine. I was thinking a day off but, suddenly I'm in OT it's only "good" on payday.

Aha!! Bull found. Now prove he's yours. Find that paperwork.. Freeze brands sound like a good idea....go for it. Goats get tattoo or id implant for registration.

Of course, both could be used just for ID of owner, too...reg or not.

 

[Baymule]

What are the advantages or disadvantages of freeze branding against hot branding?

 

[farmerjan]

No one does hot branding here... Wouldn't know where to start... sure I've seen pictures... Freeze branding does not cause the same discomfort to the animal... It also does not usually cause scarring to the hide and that is of some value. Freeze branding causes damage to the hair follicles so when it grows back in it is white. It is easily seen on a dark animal at a great distance. You do have to clip the spot so that it has good contact with the hair/skin. It requires more handling "equipment" at the outset... liquid nitrogen or alcohol and dry ice, cooler chests to hold that... and cattle need to be contained in a chute to do it...more time consuming per animal... Does not show up on a light colored animal very well, although longer time held on the animal will cause some scarring to the hide... Takes about 2 months for the new hair to regrow.

Animal rights activists here in the more "civilized east" would have a hissy fit about hot branding... at least the freeze branding is something they are not protesting....
Most of the cattle here are black or red so would show up on them.

We have one bull now that has a freeze brand on his side and sold one that also had a freeze brand... you can see from across a good distance who is who that way... can't "lose it" like the ear tags. It was easy to say, that's the "limi" bull with his numbers on his side... or that's the ginger hill bull with his GH on his hip.
Also, the RFID tags that they are pushing are a good way to be able to check on things; but they still can get cut out or occasionally lost. Plus, there is too much controversy now... because they can be used by local officials to keep track of how many animals you own.,...and there is talk about one county in this area that is talking taxing as they are "personal property".... Microchips are great, but the animal must be "wanded" to detect the chip. Tattoos on the ears are good but animal must be caught up to handle animal to see it...

Being able to see the branding from a distance is the big thing for us... if this had been the limi bull, there wouldn't have been any question from the start...

 

[fuzzi]

No one does hot branding here... Wouldn't know where to start... sure I've seen pictures... Freeze branding does not cause the same discomfort to the animal... It also does not usually cause scarring to the hide and that is of some value. Freeze branding causes damage to the hair follicles so when it grows back in it is white. It is easily seen on a dark animal at a great distance. You do have to clip the spot so that it has good contact with the hair/skin. It requires more handling "equipment" at the outset... liquid nitrogen or alcohol and dry ice, cooler chests to hold that... and cattle need to be contained in a chute to do it...more time consuming per animal... Does not show up on a light colored animal very well, although longer time held on the animal will cause some scarring to the hide... Takes about 2 months for the new hair to regrow.

Animal rights activists here in the more "civilized east" would have a hissy fit about hot branding... at least the freeze branding is something they are not protesting....
Most of the cattle here are black or red so would show up on them.

We have one bull now that has a freeze brand on his side and sold one that also had a freeze brand... you can see from across a good distance who is who that way... can't "lose it" like the ear tags. It was easy to say, that's the "limi" bull with his numbers on his side... or that's the ginger hill bull with his GH on his hip.
Also, the RFID tags that they are pushing are a good way to be able to check on things; but they still can get cut out or occasionally lost. Plus, there is too much controversy now... because they can be used by local officials to keep track of how many animals you own.,...and there is talk about one county in this area that is talking taxing as they are "personal property".... Microchips are great, but the animal must be "wanded" to detect the chip. Tattoos on the ears are good but animal must be caught up to handle animal to see it...

Being able to see the branding from a distance is the big thing for us... if this had been the limi bull, there wouldn't have been any question from the start...

Glad you've found your stray.

Isn't it just typical of government officials to contrive another way to tax people? Property isn't yours if it can be taken away for not paying protection money taxes.