Questions on Buying Additional Land

[Baymule]

@babsbag 50% down and a 5 year payout? That's crazy! You make a very valid point about buying raw land versus land with a house. @lpyrbby you might have to buy the land with mobile home so you can get a better loan, then rent it out to pay the notes until paid off. Mobile homes have serial numbers, so I doubt you could sell it or get rid of it until the loan was paid. You might consult a friendly loan officer on the ins and outs of this transaction. find out what you can and can't do.

 

[babsbag]

@Baymule it is crazy and I pretty much gave up trying to buy any vacant land right now. All the banks want me to put a home on it and I just want to run my goats on it. The banks are also very leery about loans for investment property vs. a primary home; they don't make it easy. Most people buying vacant land are paying cash. So for me the best bet is to wait for the dairy to get done and then finance land as part of that business. Maybe that is just in CA but I would venture a guess that it is everywhere.

Also, most mobile homes are not real property (as in real estate) they are considered personal property and banks won't finance them and the land together unless they are on a permanent foundation, a certain age, and maybe even has to be a double wide (not sure about that). They are usually called manufactured homes when they meet the criteria for being real property. A mobile home on land is usually financed like you would a car but for more years. Often times the bank wants you to own the land the mobile home is on or they want it in a park.

Yes...I have done my homework. I live in a manufactured home on 5 acres that is financed as real estate and have been trying to do a refi for the last few years so I have researched just about every angle possible.

 

[lpyrbby]

When we were looking, we weren't told that trailers were impossible, just DIFFICULT. I *think* I can go into this with the intention of it just being a land loan. The people who own the property, they are actually the son/daughter in law of the family that built the house that we're living in. I suspect that they may have acquired the land cheap. I'll have to find out more about the trailer status, of course, but I think there's some actual ability here to obtain it. I've been consistently told that land loans are usually 20% down and yes, a shorter loan term, but about 10 years instead.

I'll get with my lender as well too, after the holiday, as I think she'll be able to offer some extra input on the loan challenges that we might face.

Is there anything else to consider when buying a property like this for livestock use?

 

[babsbag]

20% down sounds a lot better than 50%. I can't really think of anything else for livestock. Fencing is a big one for me but maybe yours is already fenced. Having water available is a huge plus.

 

[lpyrbby]

Nope, no fencing exists on either mine or theirs, so that's one a hefty expense right off the bat to make it usable. It's not a deal breaker though since I'd have the flexibility to make the pastures what I want.

I *am* starting to second guess my thought for having the barn-thing on the other property though. In trying to consider possible bad behaviors with feeding, part of me wants an option to be able to hang feed buckets over the fence so they aren't getting practice with being pushy with people for food. Putting the barn on the other side of the property means I would have to go the long way around or walk through the pasture.

At least I have the opportunity to think about all these nuances now LOL

 

[Baymule]

@lprybby we bought 8 acres with a doublewide on it. And that's all there was. No fence, no barn, no nothing. We bought one of those "instant" metal carports. I have lumber stacked under it right now. We had our portable building moved up here. With the help of a neighbor, we got about 2 acres fenced and we moved our horses. We moved in February.

Then the fencing began. It is slow work when first a path must be hacked, mowed and chainsawed through the wilderness. We got the last stretch cleared a few weeks ago and will finish the fence hopefully before spring. We built a hoop coop for the chickens, a hawg hut for the pigs. The garden is fenced and we have two other pastures fenced. We built a small shelter for the sheep. We are slowly getting a 36'x36 barn put up.

Carefully consider placement of fences, buildings, and gates. Set it up for maximum efficiency, movement of livestock and ease of use. Where you will be taking equipment through, hang 16' gates. Better to have too wide a gate and never need it, than too narrow a gate and need more room. Most of my gates are 12' and allow for pass through of my tractor. A few gates are 16' because of swing room for big tractors. So far, it was a good idea to hang the 16' gates. Cab tractors making round bale hay deliveries and dump trucks bringing in dirt and our truck and trailer have needed that extra room.

We are using 2"x4"x48" non climb horse wire in 200' rolls. We buy it at Tractor Supply, along with 7' T-posts. The wire is $220 a roll, there are cheaper types of wire out there, but the horse wire is the way to go.

Place your barn so you can get to it without having to walk through the pasture. If you have hungry animals, an over protective mama cow/goat/sheep or a bull/ram/buck in breeding season, it could be dangerous to walk through "their" territory. The lady we bought our sheep from put feed troughs on the outside of the fence with a cow panel in front of it. The cow panel has 6" squares and the sheep can poke their heads through the holes and eat from the trough. When she shook the can of feed, it started a stampede.

Draw up a blueprint of fence, gates and barn/3 sided sheds. Is there a gully or creek to cross with the fence? Is there water run off to deal with? Is there hills to fence? Draw cross fences and gates. You can always change it, but having it on paper will help.

 

[lpyrbby]

Fortunately, we're on fairly flat land. There are a couple of other concerns though, the more I stare at their property. One, the section they use for their driveway can get extremely muddy when it rains. I'm also pretty sure they don't haul their trash to the dump and instead, just burn it in the fire pit out in their yard. Another concern is the sheer number of vehicles he has in the yard, most not running. It's not an impossibility that things from those vehicles has leaked into the yard. I still want the land, but it probably would sit for quite some time before I'd be able to make use of it.

We're planning on a three rail wood post fence with woven wire to help keep smaller critters in (we're only planning on chickens, goats, and at least one donkey/mule/horse, although I do want two). We're also planning on putting up gates with gate openers at both of our driveways. That will actually get done before any pastures or additional land purchase happens. We had a situation just before Thanksgiving where a small group of teenagers came strolling down our driveway with a four wheeler and golf cart. Fortunately, one of our neighbors is retired and raised holy hell at them so they left in a hurry. I'm pretty territorial and don't approve of unauthorized visitors lol.

Sadly, that's all I have a firm idea on at the moment. Taking the adjacent property out of the equation, since ours is all we can actually work with at this time, I'm still having a hard time trying to decide the best layout of where things should go for efficiency and where things (like a garden) will actually thrive.

I suppose it's a good thing we're not in a financial position to get started on all the things. It gives me a bit more time to try to sort out what I want and where I want it, and what we'll have to build to make it functional.

 

[Baymule]

Our place was a HUD repo. The previous owners never had trash pick up. News flash! Earth to IDIOTS! GLASS AND CANS DON'T BURN!! Have picked up buckets and buckets of glass, beer bottles, cans and general garbage. And they had burn piles all over the place. The list is endless....3 sofas, shoes, above ground pool liner, carpet, toys, picture frames, toilets, glass shower doors, SEVENTEEN HUNDRED POUNDS OF METAL truckloads of bagged garbage, 5 bedspring units, filth of all kinds. And there was a house here 50-60 years ago when the accepted practice was to have a burn pile-have found some very interesting things. I swear someday I will dig up an antique car!

Trust me, you will get it all cleaned up and it will look great. You want to use woven wire..... whatever you do, don't use welded wire. It is total crap and you might as well use toilet paper. Field fencing is another one that gets broken and torn up easily....ask me how I know..... Horses are hard on a fence and will paw it because they know how much it costs and how much work went into building it and because they have a perverse pleasure in seeing you do it all over again.