Vaccinating and disbudding

[chandasue]

So my nigerian is due in March and I am facing all that comes with kid management. I don't plan to keep the kids but I am thinking of bottle feeding them to ease their transition out of the "herd" (I only have 2 goats). I am planning on disbudding but I'm not a big fan of vaccinations in general. However I am concerned about tetanus being a problem with the disbudding and if we have any bucks to wether. I know of people that do both with out vaccinating with no problems but I'd like to get some more info and what precautions can I take, like does applying a triple antibiotic (like the over the counter stuff) or iodine help?
(Don't beat me up for being weird about vaccinations...I'm not against antibiotics or chemical wormers to save a goat but I want to keep it as natural as possible since these are our lil' milk supply.)

 

[freemotion]

No one is allowed to get on your case in the ORGANIC section! I, too, am nervous about vaccinations, but have been using CD&T until I can hear from people who do without with good success.

So....

 

[aggieterpkatie]

Many organic farmers follow conventional vaccine protocols. Most vaccines are allowed under federal guidelines.

My two cents: part of good animal husbandry/animal health is preventative maintenance. If you can vaccinate your animal for common diseases (especially a once a year vaccine like CD/T), then do it! If you won't do CD/T, then at least give the tetanus antitoxin when doing things like castrating/disbudding. Antibiotic ointment won't prevent tetanus.

I know some people who don't vaccinate their sheep for CD/T, and they've not had any problems that I'm aware of. BUT, I like to give it (it's the only routine vaccine I give) because it's a standard vaccine and I've never had any side effects from giving it. I like to prevent disease rather than try to treat it naturally.

 

[ksalvagno]

I would probably recommend giving the CD/T. Especially if you are planning to sell them. Kids die so quickly if they get any of that. I try not to overdo vaccines because there are so many others you could give if you wanted to but the CD/T is one I don't skip.

If you plan to keep kids, then try it and see what happens. If you don't plan to keep kids, then I would consider what can happen if you sell a kid and it dies from tetanus or something. Will the buyer come back to you or will there be hard feelings and they just tell everyone else. Just something to think about.

 

[chandasue]

Sounds like there's no getting around CD/T as a minimum. And good point that I'd hate for the kids to die and have the buyer come after me or give me a bad name for it.

 

[()relics]

I would agree CD/T is in the "Probably shouldn't skip" class...As well as tetanus antitoxin when you dehorn them...Without knowing the tetanus history of your particular farm...Tetanus is rather unforgiving to kids...With 2 CD/T vacinations and the antitoxin you will almost eliminate tetanus as a potential problem...If you skip it and your kids come down with tetanus type symptoms the medication parade begins if you want to save them.
Let me add: This IS Just My Opinion...

 

[cmjust0]

va

I am planning on disbudding but I'm not a big fan of vaccinations in general. However I am concerned about tetanus being a problem with the disbudding and if we have any bucks to wether. I know of people that do both with out vaccinating with no problems but I'd like to get some more info and what precautions can I take, like does applying a triple antibiotic (like the over the counter stuff) or iodine help?

I would advise against applying anything to the site of the wound which could help it heal.. You want the ring of the disbudding iron to effectively fry the blood vessels leading to the tissue within the ring, causing that inner tissue to die, dry up, and eventually pop off. If you put some type of cream, salve, etc on there to promote healing in the area or keep it more hydrated, some of the tissue may regenerate.. All it takes is a teeny, tiny blood flow to keep some of the tissue alive. Whatever cells live will grow scurs.

For the record, vaccinations are OK in an organic program. I know your objection probably isn't about what is and what isn't allowed according to the USDA, etc...but understand that they're allowed.

Yeah, they contain a whole big bunch of scary ingredients...formaldehyde, for instance. Do we want to eat formaldehyde!? Of course not...but did you know that the human body produces about 1.5oz of formaldehyde a day, all on its own?

Yep.

"But C/D-T has mercury in it!"...well, probably. Technically, anyway.. Most I've seen contain thimerosal, which contains ethylmercury. There's a big, big difference between mercury and ethylmercury, though, in the way the body is able to clear it. I'm not personally a big fan of thimerosal, but if you look at it objectively...thimerosal does not equal mercury.

Hydrochloric acid?!? Yep...maybe. But if you look at a bottle of B-Complex, it may say the same thing. Or, it may say "sodium hydroxide" -- lye. They're simply used to level the pH and make it safe.. Indeed, if a strong base didn't contain some hydrochloric acid, it would be even more dangerous.

Then you hear people say things like "Vaccines contain antifreeze!!" Which, of course, is just false..

Did you know, though, that there's a less-toxic form of antifreeze called "propylene glycol?" Perhaps that term rings a bell to goatfolk.. Yep...it's the same stuff with which you drench a doe to keep her from dying from pregnancy toxemia. Depending on how you wanted to word it -- depending on the agenda -- a person could say that the cure for pregnancy toxemia is antifreeze and be technically correct.

Sounds awfully scary, huh?!?

The bottom line for me, I guess, is that my animals' health and wellbeing sorta comes before mine. I know that probably sounds ridiculous to a lot of people, but I just wouldn't feel right about putting my animals at risk of a clostridial gut infection or tetanus just so I can enjoy a glass of milk without wondering how much of that 2ml of vaccine may have come with it..

And FWIW, I'd also highly recommend drawing up 2ml of water in a syringe, then squirting it out onto a plate or into a cup to sorta get a guage on just how little 2ml is of anything. We're talking about a few drops, literally..

But...that's all just me.