Winter, Predators and "No Mind"

BrendaMNgri

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"In Burbank people cannot walk their dogs in the evening without being followed by packs of coyotes and my friend's granddaughter was surrounded in her car by a pack of 5 who would not let her out of her car in her own driveway in a residential community - small lots in Burbank!"

If people would recognize the fact that there are lots of coyotes around, lion, bear, etc., and go on walks prepared, ditch the victim mindset, be AWARE of what is going on around them, maybe take control of a situation instead of whining and playing helpless….well…ah but its so much more fun to cry "I'm afraid of the big bad wolf." I kind of think if a guy isn't cowboy enough to be able to scare off a coyote or a wolf from the back of a horse, then he probably has no business farming let alone calling himself a cowboy. For God's sake. And I don't mean by using a gun, bullets may be the perpetual answer for some gun braggart trigger-happy people but it can also land you in a lot of trouble if you fire off in populated areas.

Oh, and as for hunting restrictions being the problem???

Um, let's see. In NV there is open season 365/24/7 on coyotes. No restrictions. You literally see guys driving through my town with pick up beds full of dead coyotes.

Guess what? It does not stop or curtail them, in fact, it makes it worse. Because indiscriminate culling takes out the wrong pack members, a well-adjusted pack of coyotes that was staying away from farms, is soon screwed up and dysfunctional, and dining on lamb where as before it was content to dine on quail and ground squirrel. Hunting and killing them all is NOT the answer.

Predators serve a purpose.
 
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greybeard

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I kind of think if a guy isn't cowboy enough to be able to scare off a coyote or a wolf from the back of a horse, then he probably has no business farming let alone calling himself a cowboy.

Scare it off to where?
One of my neighbors' places?

And they do the same, for the predator to eventually wind up back at my place, and then back at theirs? No thanks.
There's 160,000 acres of National Forest right outside my fences. As long as they stay in there, I'm fine with them. Cross that line, they're in peril, and all my neighbors are of the same mind and always have been. We don't believe in making our problems someone else's problems. The state law is pretty clear about it, regarding coyotes and any other canine.
 

Southern by choice

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I strongly disagree. Idaho and Wyoming and soon to be Colorado and Montana are having serious wolf issues because bleeding heart city folk think wolves are wonderful.
They care less about farmers or their livestock. In today's world there is a war on against cattle farmers, dairy farmers... pretty much any kind of livestock.
Many vegans and ARA are becoming super militant, violent and are acting more like terrorists. The politicians snuggle up to those who shout the loudest. Unfortunately farmers are to busy farming and doing real work to constantly stay active politically. Their voices go unheard.

Also, a rancher "cowboy" as you mention... skilled... did as you say and when 5 wolves surrounded HER she shot. Since then her family has suffered greatly.
There is a mentality that wildlife is far more valuable than human or livestock.

I am not a believer in just killing off everything either but we are a culture of non - hunters. There once was a balance. Now it is completely out of balance. Thus so many issues.

Wolves kill for fun, they don't just take out the old or weak. 30 sheep in a night... strewn about. It is fun for them. As far as coyotes. With no natural predators, only man, they do quickly get out of hand. Cats are becoming a favorite of coyotes in suburbs.
 

Ridgetop

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Strange to see the article about the California Grizzly being taken in Sunland! Shadow Hills where we live is Sunland where the foothills begin. The Big Tujunga wash leads through Sunland into the Angeles Crest National Forest which in its turn leads into the San Gabriel mountains. Even though there are some neighborhoods between the Wash and us, there is also a lot of open land where the predators travel.

Coyote packs are very prevalent in down town Los Angeles itself. While I do not want to eradicate wildlife, I do think that the city should do something about the large numbers of coyotes roaming city streets. In neighborhoods where there was a proven danger Animal control would sometimes trap and euthanize problem coyotes. This practice was ended some years ago which is why we now have so many coyotes roaming. Remember that Los Angeles used to be all orchards and fields. Many of those fruit trees are still bearing fruit in established neighborhoods. Also there is no lack of small dogs and cats in city neighborhoods. We are not talking about horse properties or farmland here.The sheer number of coyotes running in packs is a danger and we have had children attacked. People walking their dogs have been attacked as the coyotes attempted to snatch their dogs. It is unreasonable to expect people to keep their children inside and not to go outside from fear of being attacked by coyotes in a city neighborhood. Especially established neghborhoods that have been around for 60 years or more.

However, we live in Liberal Town so . . . . Here is a example of how our city council works: About 15 years ago animal control used to trap raccoons, possums, and skunks in the city and neighborhoods where they had become a problem by their numbers. (some developed rabies) These trapped animals were euthanized. Peta complained to the city council. Some of the city council members were animal rights people who also opposed the euthanizing of these animals. The city council demanded that the animal control officers collect the trapped animals live and then the city council members chartered a helicopter to take them into the National Forest where they were released into the wild. Since they were animal lovers but not trained biologists, they ignored the fact that they were upsetting the biological balance of the area they released these animals. This was a big photo opportunity to garner Peta and animal rights votes.

BUT it is illegal to release captured wild animals back into the wild without the approval of the Federal Fish and Wildlife authorities. Fish and Game complained to the city council who voted to ignore them. Subsequently the Federal Wildflife authorities brought an injunction against them to stop the "merciful relocations". The city council (remember this is California and LA) ignored the federal prohibitions. The punchline? The area where the city council was dropping the raccoons, possums and skunks was a designated area where a threatened species of frog or toad lived. Of course, thanks to our merciful animal loving city council members the toad or frog didn't live there much longer. Thank you Los Angeles City Council and PETA for eradicating an endangered species.

Of course, since this is California our state people have also practically eradicated our farms in the San Joaquin Valley by refusing to give them water since an insignificant minnow might be endangered. The big valley is now a dust bowl. Farmers are the endangered species there.
 

Simpleterrier

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So if a pack of coyotes kill grouse and mice and a human kills some of the pack they will resort to killing sheep since there is less of them.


Um kinda don't make any since to me I would think the more u kill and the smaller the pack the more likely they would hunt smaller prey.
 
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