A Little Help With Goat Dewormers

[babsbag]

I have 40 goats so individual feeding is out of the question LOL

@Kaye The general consensus among my friends on Safeguard for goats is that if you use it at 3-4 times the dose listed on the bottle for 3 days in a row it works. I am fortunate to live in area where worms are pretty much a non-issue. Our pastures are dry all summer and no standing water in the winter so I use Safeguard only for tape worms.

 

[Kaye]

@babsbag why does everyone say to use so much more??
I will try to do a little more research... But what other is a good alternative to safeguard?
I'm pretty sure Elvis wouldn't eat pellet form... He's the pickiest goat in the world. I'm just thinking I want something easy to administer and trusted.
@NH homesteader please let me know what you think!!

 

[babsbag]

I believe that the reason is because goats have a much higher metabolism and most drugs have to be dosed at higher rates to work effectively. This dosage is what was suggested by my vet and by the vets of other members of BYH. The dose on the bottle is what is used on cattle, which works for cattle, but it doesn't work on a goat.

I cc. / 10lbs. for 3 days and if really wormy repeat in 10 days.

Personally I have and will worm with Ivermectin, it is much easier. But again, worms are not really an issue for me; at least Barber Pole worms aren't. Tapes on the other hand...

 

[NH homesteader]

If you search through the forums there is a ton of information about dewormers! I also used Safeguard at 1cc/10 lbs... Haven't done another fecal yet, since my worm issue just happened.

 

[Southern by choice]

I have heard that you should never use things for horses on goats, as it could cause serious harm, but I can't be sure.

There are some dewormers that are used on multi-species.
Fenbendazole is one. It is used on goats, sheep, cattle, horses, dogs,and cats.
Ivermectin is another.

It is knowing what dosage is appropriate.

Kaye you will probably get answers both ways, and more debate! Haha, I am using it right now so I'll get back to you once I prove that it did or did not work. In the meantime there are tons of posts on here about safeguard and dewormers in general. It is my current primary goat challenge that I have spent far far too much time thinking about haha!

The debate factor is really kind of silly.
I hear all the time "such and such doesn't work" or "in our region such and such no longer works because of resistance."

The use of dewormers and resistance and it's efficacy are all related to producer following good practice.

To say something no longer works is a very broad statement and is bad information.

Reasons why resistance develops is because of improper weighing of animal. Underdosing. Improper course of treatment.
There are 3 classes of dewormers and they work differently.
When not used properly there may not be any resistance but may prove ineffective because the treatment protocol was incorrect.

Fecal analysis is important.
Proper dosage and COURSE of treatment is important.
Fecal counts prior to treatment and again after will show you reduction. You want 95% or better.

Barberpole and Flukes are both bloodsuckers. Both cause anemia.
So, someone looking at eyelids and no fecal decides to treat with Ivermectin.... hmmm ivermectin didn't work....
That person is now convinced Ivermectin doesn't work.
What the person didn't know because there was no fecal done, is that the goat didn't have barberpole but had FLUKES which is NOT treated with Ivermectin. A different dewormer is necessary.

The reason we are seeing these dewormers becoming ineffective is overuse, and laziness on the producers part.

Sometimes people deworm thinking the goat has worms and it may not be the issue at all.
Goat starts with loose or soft poo and suddenly it must be parasites but sstill they do no fecal. So the person loads them up with dewormer. Goat progressively gets worse , diarrhea ensues, more dewormer but no fecal....

So the kitchen sink is thrown at the goat and nothing. Producer is convinced those dewormers don't work, once again. But they never looked at WHAT was the issue.

We recently had a goat that started with loose poo... I ran the fecal. 1 parasitic egg which is 25EPG, and 0 cocci. Goat doesn't have parasites! Called vet gave info vet prescribed an antibiotic.
We gave injections for 5 days. It was some sort of bacterial infection was best guess by vet. Goat cleared up all is well.

IOW no amount of dewormer was going to solve the issue and if the goat wasn't treated properly the goat after so long with diarrhea would have died.

Never go by the "such and such doesn't work".... each goat, each, farm, individual management is what makes the difference.

 

[NH homesteader]

I was trying to figure out how to tag you, glad you found this post! I think there is a lack of good goat vets and general lack of knowledge about this particular issue. Also in many areas like mine it is cost prohibitive to pay a vet for all these fecals and when there also aren't any breeders like you nearby who will help people learn these things it's so hard to find your way!

 

[Southern by choice]

I strongly recommend getting a scope. This is never to replace VETERINARY care. It is a tool used for herd management. When first learning to do fecals it is best to take the same sample you are working with and send it in to a lab or vet etc so you can see how you are doing.

Over time as you get to know your goats you will not need to run as many. It will however be a great tool in management.
You will find eventually you will pull your scope out at certain times. Maybe before breeding, before kidding, post kidding. You wwill definitely want one when it comes time for kids!

 

[babsbag]

I am fortunate to have a friend that for years has been running fecals and teaching how to do them; she runs mine whenever I think there might be a problem. We seldom hear of or see liver flukes or lung worms as we don't have the snail and standing water problem. In someways my hot dry summers are a blessing. Cocci, which isn't a worm per se, is what we usually find in kids and on a rare occasion in adults. My big causes of un-thrifty looking goats are selenium and copper deficiency; we all have our challenges.

@NH homesteader ...to tag someone you put an @ in front of their username, no space.

 

[NH homesteader]

Oh well that's not very complicated now is it? I live without a computer or WiFi so thefact that my phone even lets me use this site is amazing haha.

 

[Kaye]

I strongly recommend getting a scope. This is never to replace VETERINARY care. It is a tool used for herd management. When first learning to do fecals it is best to take the same sample you are working with and send it in to a lab or vet etc so you can see how you are doing.

Over time as you get to know your goats you will not need to run as many. It will however be a great tool in management.
You will find eventually you will pull your scope out at certain times. Maybe before breeding, before kidding, post kidding. You wwill definitely want one when it comes time for kids!

That sounds so cool!! I have a scope, but it a pretty cheap one and I can't find parts for it. One of the lenses broke. I will definitely be getting a new one. Now I just need someone to teach me. This could really come in handy with Baby (or special needs goat) when his feet problems flare up... I could do my own research and try to find some answers!! Not only our goats, but with our rabbits, chickens, and turkeys as well

I am fortunate to have a friend that for years has been running fecals and teaching how to do them; she runs mine whenever I think there might be a problem. We seldom hear of or see liver flukes or lung worms as we don't have the snail and standing water problem. In someways my hot dry summers are a blessing. Cocci, which isn't a worm per se, is what we usually find in kids and on a rare occasion in adults. My big causes of un-thrifty looking goats are selenium and copper deficiency; we all have our challenges.

@NH homesteader ...to tag someone you put an @ in front of their username, no space.

I'm jealous. I need a friend like this who lives close by and can teach me this wisdom!!