Guardian dog chewed up a goat today.

[countrywife]

Last time my GP got a goat, hubby threatened to shoot him. Then I had to explain to my husband if he shot my dog, i would have to shoot him. It is frustrating, but I am with you. I will do what I need to do, but that dog is staying here. When he matures, he will be wonderful. And by the way, mine is neutered. Patience and vigilance, I think you will make it. We can have a "owners of wayward juvenile delinquent GPs" support group.

 

[Grillo]

I wonder if this is genetic. I have two pyrs. In fact one of them is not purebred, she looks just like a pyr but she doesn't have the double dews and her tail does not make the wheel, she lifts it into a sable when excited. Anyway, the pyr cross is too playful. She LOVES to play. When I go out to the yard she's all over me, getting in the way, trying to get pet I just call her "rogona" (spanish for "needy") Kira, the younger one, is purebred and while she always come and greet and will stay relatively close to me at feed time she never is trying to get petted, doesn't show any interest in playing with the chickens and takes her job as guardian very seriously. The purebred did not see a chicken till she was 7 months, but after a couple of clear hard corrections when she tried to chase chickens she has been wonderful. The pyr cross (Kiromi) who I have raised and trained with chickens since three months old (she's the oldest at 14 months) still tries to play with the chickens every now and then and will pester me and Kira to no end trying to play. The purebred just turned 10 months and acts like a mature dog since she turned 8 months. I wonder if this is genetic, I really like Kira's temperament because I hate dogs that are always at your heels trying to get your attention. Anyway, the pyr cross will get spayed in a few months and the purebred will stay unaltered as possible breeding material down the road.

 

[Roll farms]

You can have an entire range of temperaments in one litter of pups...there just are no rules when it comes to animals, some will not fit into whatever mold they're supposed to.

It could be genetic, but it could also just be the nature of the beast, so to speak.

Same sex LGD, even when both are fixed, usually end up fighting (sometimes with a tragic outcome) by the time they're 2 yrs old. You might consider keeping them in seperate pastures.
Females can be especially mean to eachother.

 

[mnblonde]

This has happened to me one too-that dog was dealt with immedietly-and i did not re~home her-that would be just giving a problem to someone else- JMHO
MNBlonde

What did you do with the dog then?

i shot her-was the only ting to do-her "wireing "was wrong--she never really acted normal-she was a pry/akbash cross--thats what i was told-she was raised on a sheep farm-i got her at 12 weeks-she was manic-crazy playful and then suddenly morose and growly-a couple times she actually scared me-then she killed 5 milk goats and hurt 2 others badly that was the end-she was about 2 years old then

 

[dianneS]

I wonder if this is genetic. I have two pyrs. In fact one of them is not purebred, she looks just like a pyr but she doesn't have the double dews and her tail does not make the wheel, she lifts it into a sable when excited. Anyway, the pyr cross is too playful.

Hmmm... interesting. My dog has a tiny touch of Pyr in him. His mother was part Pyr and her owner had to re-home her for chicken killing. The breeder keeps blaming the Pyr in my dog for the problems I'm having, since she had so much trouble with her Pyr cross, and had no trouble with her pure Karakachan. I guess she figured by breeding her female to a pure Karakachan and the puppies having such little pyr in them, that the Karakachan side would prevail.

I do know of a breeder who breeds 1/2 Karakachan and 1/2 Pyr and she says that is what people are asking for. She said the Pyr in them makes them friendlier and more personable, where a pure Karakachan is too aloof toward people.

 

[Roll farms]

I had 2 pyrs who've never harmed a chicken...you can't blame the breed.

There are no set in stone rules w/ any breed....every dog breed can have differences in the temperament.

 

[countrywife]

I simply think it is temperment. The GP book I bought before I got the dog says that poultry and the GP is a hit and miss. Some are ok, some are not. I find that in all the dog breeds. My GP is fine with the poultry, and they come in his kennel and literally walk all over him. My boy was barn born, to working parents, and has never seen the inside of a house. I was adamant about buying from working parents. I am beginning to think that people simply expect too much too soon, whcih is somethign else the book cautioned against. They GROW to be great guardian dogs, but they do have their developmental stages like all other breeds, and even our human children for that matter. You simply cannot get a LGD and throw it in the field and never look after it again, no matter what breed you use. There have to be guidelines, and you have to enforce them. I guess you could occasionally find a pup you could throw out there, but I bet they are few and far between. Now, I also believe there are simply dogs that are not made for farm life, no matter the breed. And you have to recognize that act accordingly. We have had a few pups over the years that just did not do well with the livestock or chickens. Sometimes, they just don't cut it. (no, I don't think a book answers all the questions, but it gave me great info when I was buying my pup, and has been quite handy for training.)

 

[dianneS]

I am beginning to think that people simply expect too much too soon, whcih is somethign else the book cautioned against. They GROW to be great guardian dogs, but they do have their developmental stages like all other breeds, and even our human children for that matter. You simply cannot get a LGD and throw it in the field and never look after it again, no matter what breed you use.

I was fully prepared in the beginning to "train" my Karakachan, and had no intentions of putting him in with the goats unsupervised. But the woman I got him from insisted that I just "throw" in in the field with the goats and he would know what to do! I even spoke to the breeder of her dogs who told me to do the same thing. They insisted that I do things this way, as if any training or confinement at all would somehow ruin him.

Now that I'm having trouble with him, the breeder is blaming the 1/4 Great Pyr that is in him, since she was able to leave her full-blood Karakachan in with the goats unsupervised from day one and he was fine. Now she's telling me that the pup she kept from the same litter as my dog, is chasing her smallest doe too! And she's blaming the Great Pyr cross and keeps hoping that the Karakachan breeding will eventually prevail! I'm thinking that she just got lucky with her Karakachan and not all of them are that trustworthy from the start either. I think that they all need some training.

 

[Grillo]

Just for the record. My pyr cross is not a chicken killer, she wouldn't be here if she was. She did dispatch 2 very small pullets when younger by literally licking them to death. No puncture wounds or broken bones of any sort, but soaked in slobber. She no longer licks the chickens and no longer bothers them in a real sense like when she was younger. But she is very obnoxious in her play displays and will sometimes scare the chickens by moving too fast among them, which I really hate. I fully expect her to be a competent LGD when she matures and every month she gets better and better as she approaches maturity. But it was very noticeable contrast to the purebred, who despite never laying eyes in a chicken till 7 months took to guarding and leaving chickens alone in a matter of days after introduction and I fully trust her alone with the chickens while the cross is still separated and only allowed chicken time under supervision. Not because of fear of her killing the chickens anymore, but because she sometimes ends up running them off the chicken yard.

I don't think the pyr as breed can be blamed for playfulness because the purebred is just superb at 10 months old. I really expect her to be an extraordinary guardian when she reaches full maturity.

 

[dianneS]

But it was very noticeable contrast to the purebred, who despite never laying eyes in a chicken till 7 months took to guarding and leaving chickens alone in a matter of days after introduction and I fully trust her alone with the chickens while the cross is still separated and only allowed chicken time under supervision.

I don't think the pyr as breed can be blamed for playfulness because the purebred is just superb at 10 months old. I really expect her to be an extraordinary guardian when she reaches full maturity.

That must be what the breeder of my dog is thinking. That is the Pyr cross, not the pure pyr that can be a problem. But on the other hand I know another breeder who is having great success with Pyr/Karakachan cross breeds! Who knows? I was told not to breed my Karakachan with a Maremma for some reason, they seem to think that makes a "bad" combination? I don't know where that came from, but it could be based entirely on one person's experience with one litter or even one dog, I have no idea.