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Debby
Chillin' with the herd
Pitchfork, thanks for your advise.
I'll keep it in mind.
Debby
I'll keep it in mind.
Debby
Devon Milking Cows (New Pics 1/29/14)
- Thread starter Debby
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jhm47
True BYH Addict
The other day, I went to a car accident. The driver was killed, not wearing a seat belt. Thrown from the vehicle when it rolled multiple times. His wife, who was wearing a seat belt was injured only slightly, and stayed in the vehicle. She was somewhat shook up, and we transported her to a nearby hospital. She said over and over that if she could have just convinced him to wear his seatbelt, he'd still be alive.
Now, this person had been driving for (I would guess) around 40 - 45 years. How many times had he driven without his seatbelt and not had any trouble? It was just this ONE time that got him. He played the odds for many years, but his number finally came up, and he was killed. For what reason? He didn't like the confinement of wearing a seat belt. I hope the confinement of his new casket doesn't bother him.
Those of you who feel that horns are OK are playing the exact same game. You are playing the odds, and might or might not ever get caught. The question is this: Do you buckle your seatbelt when you are in a vehicle? Do you put your children in a car seat when they are in a vehicle? Really, the odds of you having an accident are very small, so let's just keep those horns on, and quit with this seatbelt/carseat nonsense. And while we're at it, let's get rid of those unsightly smoke detectors. The odds of your house catching fire are very small, so we really don't need smoke detectors either.
I have raised cattle for over 55 years. I still raise my own herd, and artificially breed over 1000 head for other farmers and ranchers each year. Usually, I can just look at a cow/heifer and tell if she's a problem animal or not. This site is a "backyard cows" site. I would assume that many of you are not very experienced with cattle, and that you don't have the experience of many decades of handling them. For this reason, I feel that it's best for you to err on the side of safety. You wouldn't recommend that a student driver not wear his/her seatbelt would you?
Now---I may have offended some of you. I'm not sorry. If what I have posted here saves just one person from being injured/killed (and I will never know if it does), it is worth it.
'Nuff said on this subject by me!
Now, this person had been driving for (I would guess) around 40 - 45 years. How many times had he driven without his seatbelt and not had any trouble? It was just this ONE time that got him. He played the odds for many years, but his number finally came up, and he was killed. For what reason? He didn't like the confinement of wearing a seat belt. I hope the confinement of his new casket doesn't bother him.
Those of you who feel that horns are OK are playing the exact same game. You are playing the odds, and might or might not ever get caught. The question is this: Do you buckle your seatbelt when you are in a vehicle? Do you put your children in a car seat when they are in a vehicle? Really, the odds of you having an accident are very small, so let's just keep those horns on, and quit with this seatbelt/carseat nonsense. And while we're at it, let's get rid of those unsightly smoke detectors. The odds of your house catching fire are very small, so we really don't need smoke detectors either.
I have raised cattle for over 55 years. I still raise my own herd, and artificially breed over 1000 head for other farmers and ranchers each year. Usually, I can just look at a cow/heifer and tell if she's a problem animal or not. This site is a "backyard cows" site. I would assume that many of you are not very experienced with cattle, and that you don't have the experience of many decades of handling them. For this reason, I feel that it's best for you to err on the side of safety. You wouldn't recommend that a student driver not wear his/her seatbelt would you?
Now---I may have offended some of you. I'm not sorry. If what I have posted here saves just one person from being injured/killed (and I will never know if it does), it is worth it.
'Nuff said on this subject by me!
Well jmh47 two of us trying to "preserve" this breed for the future are Veterinary professionals so we should very well know the dangers. If you read Debbys posts she stated that she was a Vet and I am a RVT.
The reason for keeping horns on these cattle have been stated. I personally have experience raising Charolettes talk about trouble!!!! These old breeds are often times the genetic base of the modern breeds. What happens when all you breeders need to reinfuse something that you have lost??? You will be coming to us to save them!!! Don't go on the attack when you don't understand!!!!
The reason for keeping horns on these cattle have been stated. I personally have experience raising Charolettes talk about trouble!!!! These old breeds are often times the genetic base of the modern breeds. What happens when all you breeders need to reinfuse something that you have lost??? You will be coming to us to save them!!! Don't go on the attack when you don't understand!!!!
JerseyXGirl
Chillin' with the herd
I've had two acquaintances die this year due to livestock. None due to cattle. One from being thrown from his horse doing a round up and the other was kicked by his horse. Any livestock weighing in at 1000 lbs is dangerous horns or not. Everyone must me careful when dealing with them.
Oh and we had one boy sent to the ER due to being head butted in the chest by a goat w/no horns.
Oh and we had one boy sent to the ER due to being head butted in the chest by a goat w/no horns.
Imissmygirls
Lonley for cows
I , too, err on the cautious side when explaining cattle handling to newbies. I think it's better for new owners to know the worst rather than feel safe with these large animals. They may look like warm cuddly critters, but they can injure severely and not even realize they are hurting you. The calf that rubs its head against your leg in play is only practicing its adult dominance technique.
Those who are experienced animal handlers are one thing. But would they give the same advice to a newbie who thinks those sweet warm eyes are almost human and wants to cuddle a 1000 lb animal?
Caution Caution caution
Those who are experienced animal handlers are one thing. But would they give the same advice to a newbie who thinks those sweet warm eyes are almost human and wants to cuddle a 1000 lb animal?
Caution Caution caution
That's very interesting about the horns. Do the devon breeders care if you use horn weights to train their horns down?
I tried to figure out a way I could show and breed dairy goats with out disbudding them but the association doesn't allow horned animals.
I tried to figure out a way I could show and breed dairy goats with out disbudding them but the association doesn't allow horned animals.
jhm47
True BYH Addict
BDial: Dehorning these cattle has no effect on "preserving the breed". I have been around cattle enough to know that horns are not needed to breed or preserve them.
The fact that you are a RVT, and Debbie is a vet tells me that you probably do have some experience with cattle. However, this is a "backyard cattle" site, and I would bet that the average person here who is asking for advice has little or no experience with cattle. The prudent thing for a novice to do is to be safe.
I happen to have raised cattle for many decades. I also have been an EMT for 21 years, and have seen firsthand what horned cattle can do. I have never had to rescue a person who was injured by a polled/dehorned animal, but I have had two who were injured by horned ones. NOT pretty! I don't want anyone else to go through such a horrible experience because of not dehorning their animals.
I applaud your stance in raising a heritage breed of cattle. All heritage livestock need to be preserved.
By the way, it's Charolais, not Charolettes. And yes, they can be a handful.
The fact that you are a RVT, and Debbie is a vet tells me that you probably do have some experience with cattle. However, this is a "backyard cattle" site, and I would bet that the average person here who is asking for advice has little or no experience with cattle. The prudent thing for a novice to do is to be safe.
I happen to have raised cattle for many decades. I also have been an EMT for 21 years, and have seen firsthand what horned cattle can do. I have never had to rescue a person who was injured by a polled/dehorned animal, but I have had two who were injured by horned ones. NOT pretty! I don't want anyone else to go through such a horrible experience because of not dehorning their animals.
I applaud your stance in raising a heritage breed of cattle. All heritage livestock need to be preserved.
By the way, it's Charolais, not Charolettes. And yes, they can be a handful.
I flunked spelling sorry. 
when breeding these cattle if you dehorn no one will buy from you (according to my breeder) and they are still used for oxen. If you dehorn it can't be used for oxen.
Average Joe newbie and cattle with horns...... heck no. That IS a bad combination. I agree get to know cattle before dealing with the horns. Horns on goats is one thing (and I have seen injuries with that) but a cow with horns can be 10x worse in the wrong situation.
I still can't wait to get my girls!!!! Yummy milk and cheese!!!! When does spring get here????
when breeding these cattle if you dehorn no one will buy from you (according to my breeder) and they are still used for oxen. If you dehorn it can't be used for oxen.Average Joe newbie and cattle with horns...... heck no. That IS a bad combination. I agree get to know cattle before dealing with the horns. Horns on goats is one thing (and I have seen injuries with that) but a cow with horns can be 10x worse in the wrong situation.
I still can't wait to get my girls!!!! Yummy milk and cheese!!!! When does spring get here????
DanceswithCows
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How are you getting on with these? I'm kinda jealous that you guys over there have 'proper' devons 
the north devons we are left with have gone down the beef route like most other things. They are beautiful creatures though.
Just wanted to say that we have 60, don't dehorn and never, ever have an issue. If you have a nasty animal, it WILL kill you without horns quite easily. Whether you die of spiking or crushing isn't much of a concern once you're dead. A friendly, mannered animal will no more gouge you than kick or bite you! Accidents happen, but I have been clouted with muzzles and had my toes stepped on...I don't feel the need to cut the legs or noses off my cattle as a result.
Horns are a cows' crowning glory, like the mane and tail of a horse. They use them like hands, flipping stuff over, and for scratching their backs. My original ox was dehorned because I kept him on another, paranoid farm. Every day I wish I hadn't - it makes him look de-nuded
the north devons we are left with have gone down the beef route like most other things. They are beautiful creatures though.Just wanted to say that we have 60, don't dehorn and never, ever have an issue. If you have a nasty animal, it WILL kill you without horns quite easily. Whether you die of spiking or crushing isn't much of a concern once you're dead. A friendly, mannered animal will no more gouge you than kick or bite you! Accidents happen, but I have been clouted with muzzles and had my toes stepped on...I don't feel the need to cut the legs or noses off my cattle as a result.
Horns are a cows' crowning glory, like the mane and tail of a horse. They use them like hands, flipping stuff over, and for scratching their backs. My original ox was dehorned because I kept him on another, paranoid farm. Every day I wish I hadn't - it makes him look de-nuded
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- #40
Debby
Chillin' with the herd
Thanks for asking! The girls are pushing two now and are very healthy. They live on grass when its growing, hay all winter, and a free choice mineral suplimment.DanceswithCows said:
There is a little news. I just bred them by AI. This was my first attempt and the first heifer was bred about 18 days ago. So I'll know in a week or so if she is going to come back in heat. These two heifers have been very regularly and obviously in heat, so I shouldn't have any trouble seeing if I failed.
They were bred to a bull named Wild Aspargus Farm Axel. http://www.milkingdevons.org/bul_axel.html
I picked this bull entirely because his bloodlines were not represented in my heifers. This breed was quite rare in the 1970s. It got down to less than 100 animals. It can be a challenge to get unrelated out crosses and "Axel" was the best I could do amoung the 10 or so bulls available as froozen semen.
Wish me luck--I'll keep you posted.
Debby
